This has got to be one of the most stupid and ill thought out statements ever from an organisation notorious throughout the media for repeatedly putting its incredibly big mouth in gear without first engaging its brain.

There is no excuse for violence of the order you wish to excuse, MPACUK.

To label it the "Muslim *philosophy* of violence" is not simply to be ignorant of the meaning of philosophy - but is to demonstrate your own equation of violence and Islam...

How stupid is that?

Morons.

mpac when will you grow up. you are sounding like a spotty teenager going thru puberty.

I don't know if you can read, or are you putting your mouth in gear before your brain.

But to my reading no where in the article does it say 'excuse' anything .. but it does EXPLAIN AND THUS HELP us UNDERSTAND a whole lot!

A whole lot more then the corporate Media, the Government and the most of all the pro Israel lobby would like us the public to understand.

If we cannot understand the problem, we will not be able to solve it - maybe that is why you are so upset. Now what is your real reason for being upset?

Zionist ALERT ... someone kick this pro Israel fanatic out. Was it not Zionists by in large, who pushed for the wars that caused this terrorism?

It looks like this statement was written by a 11 year school. With so much poor content non of it makes sense. you are promoting violence i am muslim and our country has suffered the most compared to any muslim country yet we not reacted the same way. so why should you promote this.
Name of islam is used by ISI and MOSAD so stop being part of it.

PLEASE NOT IN OUR NAME.....

Self criticism is a very difficult state to achieve. It appears that the Muslim community has not yet reached that state.

When has the West demonstrated this? Read the news, watch television, read blogs. They are full of discussions for and against.

Without self criticism, you will wallow in your own misery and create mayhem fo everybody else.

Very informative article! Thanks mpacuk!

I think it would be smarter is Kahlid Sheik Muhamed and others whom this article is defensive of just used the twinky defense.

Thisis the best post I have ever seen from a Muslim group, a group sincere in integrating with the West and not trying to take it over!
I salute you MPACUKL!

Keep this nonsense up, the tide is rising against your ilk and this just helps.

An interesting theory to be sure. It doesn't explain everything though: Darfur, Lebanon, Pakistan for example. Then there's that nasty anti-Christian stuff going on all over, most notably in Egypt, Gaza and Iraq. The leper-like treatment of Palestinians. Why, one asks oneself?

As long as the argument is being made, you need to be specific about grievances and also expect a response that might show them to be false or explained by previous acts against the perpetrators.

It'll be quite a slice of pickle.

Masterful use of irony. No doubt many people will come by and actually believe you mean that the poor, downtrodden Muslims of Britain are justified in blowing up subway trains.

No.

There is only one cause for violence. It is rebellion against God. In the New Testament, God wrote to us through the Apostle John, "Dear friends, let us love one another, for love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God. Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love." So, whether you follow Islamic teachings or Christian or whatever, if you do not love your fellow man as God commanded, you are not of God, but of Satan. If Islam commands you to hate other people so much that you can kill them, then Islam proceeds from Satan, not from God.

What a joke. How hypocritical to post this flaunting meaningless buzzwords like 'islamophobia.'

Phobia implies irrational fear, and there is notion irrational about fearing islam and it's pedophile worshiping followers. I'm sorry you can't deal with the fact that your supposed "prophet" was a murderous warlord who had a thing for children, but the rest of the sane world doesn't have that problem.

I'm guessing that by the same token, I can explain why the West is invading your countries by showing you this video:

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=1ao2Wz1FECY

Quit murdering us or justifying murdering us because we're not like you, stop converting us, stop pretending Israel doesn't exist, stop objecting to basic principles of our societies and you might find we're interested in listening.

If you want to blame us for your terrorism, we'll blame your terrorism for our invasions.

Do you really want to go down that blame-path? You're out-gunned, out-resourced, and most Arab economies are based on digging stuff out of the ground and selling it to America, then begging for American aid.

You need us, more than we need you - oil can be found elsewhere.

Grow up. Be the Religion of Peace you claim to be.

Bye Bye
That's the last time I'll access your website.

Fools.

1. Either you will tire of war because we wont as long as you continue to support bombing and terrorism.

or

2. You will all starve to death when your oil dries up and we develop new sources of energy.

Enjoy living in the stone age.

Dont bite the hand that feeds you.

The trouble is that in so many places it is the Muslims who are the oppressors, whether against non-Muslims or other Muslims.

The root cause of the problem is a completely misplaced persecution complex which people like MPAC are trying to foist on the Muslims.

You really are morons. Seriously.
The real cause of Muslim violence is.... YOU!

Don't get me wrong, I'm no Zionist, or Iraq war supporter.

But most Muslims are NOT fighting against Israeli apartheid, or against US occupation of Iraq, or against injustice at all. Most violent Muslims are fighting not around secular issues of oppression, but to establish a fascist fundamentalist Muslim dictatorship like the ones in Afghanistan, Somalia, Saudi Arabia, etc.

Even those Muslims who are fighting against Israeli or US occupation, are usually not planning to establish freedom and democracy when their oppressors are vanquished. They want to replace the apartheid regime with their own fascist dictatorship and keep oppressing their own people.

Fight against infidelophobia.

While it’s no surprise to see a mainstream Muslim organization going out of its way to justify violence, this is certainly an odd way to do it.

MPACUK must think that posting a video of Stokely Carmichael gives them some street cred. They probably don’t realize that Carmichael’s successor was H. Rap Brown, who converted to Islam then shot a police officer and father of two young children to death in 2000.

What BS!!! The problem is islam. It is supremacist and imperialist. The US was created because of islam. The rape and murder of non muslims in Europe led the Europeans to look for other routes to India,a country that for years survived mass murder by muslims. Islam must be stopped by any means necessary!!!! And it will be.

Here we go again with excuses. Terrorists do not want to see change and neither do they have an agenda, they have been brainwashed to think that there is paradise after suicide. Blame it on years of Saudi Wahabi teachings, on the oppression they face in their countries, tyranny. Only when we denounce violence and Muslim countries move towards democracy can there be an end to terrorism.

The ludicrous Kwame Toure should have been hollowed out and made into a motorcycle suit long ago. Notice his absurd assumed names, taken from the despots of Ghana and Guinea? Hah!

The sooner you Muslims - all of you - pack and leave the British Isles* for the backward Turd World hell-holes of your choice, the better. Life might be difficult, trying to live on benefit fraud on South Waziristan, but we're forever being told how adaptable and enterprising you all are, so I feel sure you'll manage just fine.

Incidentally, I write as a kafir currently living and working in Dhahran, Saudi Arabia.

Let's assume 2,000,000 Muslims all told; over a period of of 700 days = fewer than 3,000 a day. Easy.

We'll even help you pack and drive you to the airports.

The Muslims in the British prison system - where Muslims are three times over-represented, ought to go first. The Muslim Police Association could accompany them to keep them in order.

* Yes, one IS aware that some of you "were born here". Rats and cockroaches are born in stables every day; such a nativity does NOT make them horses.

@Zebaddy

[QUOTE]Zionist ALERT ... someone kick this pro Israel fanatic out. Was it not Zionists by in large, who pushed for the wars that caused this terrorism? [/QUOTE]

I doubt very much if you would recognise Zionism if it came up behind you and bit you on your well-=appointed rear.

News Flash:

Not everyone who disagrees with you is a "Zionist".

Have you not got homework you should be doing.

So, once again, "the man" is keeping "the oppressed" down.

You want truth so here is some: While people in the West live in comfort and prosperity, most Muslims live in squalor atop of an ocean of the world's most precious resource. Sure, the man is keeping you down, but it isn't the man you think it is. Your leaders party like rock stars while you scratch in the dirt to feed your families. Your leaders convince you that your problems come from the West (colonialism).

You want truth. Who is "the man" keeping Muslims down? It is other Muslims. Now that the Iraqis have been set free, we will see how it plays out.

Bill Corr

Do you have a problem with the colour of skin or the religion?

What a load of tosh this article is. Violence is violence with no good reason or justification. Only apologists rise to the sentiments as expressed in this "article". The sooner the Muslim community at large realizes the fallacy of justifying terrorism and muzzles their own, the safer will be the world for mankind.

Or perhaps the down trodden British are justified in blowing up the Iraqis?

I am not a Muslim but I must say that talking about a man who lived over 1500 years ago as a war lord is pretty amusing, considering the warlords in israel who are making the world a war zone right now.

The ideology of war is not Islam - it IS ZIONISM

Excellent point in that video. And no, nowhere in there does it tak of justification - it helps to better understand the world around us.

And to all these cretins spouting off anti-Islam and anti-MPACUK messages... sounds like MPACUK's doing something right to get you so worked up.

It's ok, we get the MPAC message, don't keep banging on about it. We have to do exactly as the Muslim minority in this country says, or some of you will become terrorists and blow us up, and we'll deserve everything we get because we didn't obey when we had the chance. We get it, we get it.

Happykaffy - the problem is, what does the Muslim minority in this country want?

Do we do what MPAC says, or what MCB says, or what HUT says? Can we or can we not have elections? When does the state allow Muslim holidays to be held? Do we ban Shias as heretics or follow the Shia path? Do we force women to wear headscarves or full burkas? Whatever we do, there will be an angry group of dissenters waiting to blow us up.

And then there is foreign policy. Do we go along with the charming regimes in the Middle East? In that case, we get blown up for 'propping up the dictators'. Or do we refuse to let them have our food surpluses and drugs? In which case we get blown up for committing genocide on their people. Or do we try to replace them with something better? In which case we get blown up for 'invading Muslim lands' and, when their peoples take to massacring each other, we get blown up for committing genocide.

If only there were an option to hang our heads, walk in the gutter and be good dhimmis. But sadly it's not that simple.

But rather than do the hard work of thinking all this through, MPAC and its supporters can save themselves the trouble and just shout 'Zionist racist pig' at anyone who disagrees with them.

Thank goodness for that - we never thought we would get rid of you.

Say hello to the ZioNazi sites you will go to after this.

this is an embarassing statement. it's irrational, and simply knee jerk. while i agree many muslim leaders are apologetic, this on the other hand is very extreme.

also, mpac has nothing to do with democracy within isocs. it was muslim student organisations, isocs themselves, with the assistance of fosis. stop claiming credit for other people's work

You mean like the people of GAZA did when they were FREELY elected and then starved for choosing the wrong Government..

Get a life you Zionist tosser .

lol and Clinton's successor killed two million people in Iraq .. I suppose we should blame Clinton for Bush's crimes now????

What a pathetic comment. go back to israel you muppet!

Ok let me say it slowly because you are the thick one in the class and despite saying 'i get it' - really loudly you obviously do not.

Ok here goes - stop killing millions of muslims then they wont want to kill you.

Is that ok now ..?? Or does Mr Moron want to keep terrorising a killing millions of innocent civilians as a God given right?

is that was your israeli god tells you?

Absolutely right. The basis for so-called Muslim violence is political -- a response to the political order that has its roots in European colonialism and its aftermath. Today, that colonialism perpetuates itself economically, in the form of neoliberalism, widening the gulf between rich and poor, disempowering the majority, taking rights from the vulnerable, fanning the flames of racism, and degrading the planet on which we all depend. Let us remember, though, that the greatest of all Muslim anti-colonial agitators, Badshah Khan, was 100% committed to non-violence, and he is a hero the Muslim world desperately needs to cherish and remember if we are to achieve global economic, social, political and environmental justice which is essential if the whole world is to prosper into the future, insha Allah.

ISOC's are not democractic you moron. If they were democractic how many women do you running them?

Well said brother!

Excellent post and very brave mpac.

filthy subhuman muslim vermin - there's no place for you rodents among humans.
go back to the third world toilets that spawned you.

MPAC who are you? Trying to divide Muslims; insulting and deriding our elders and scholars; promoting democracy over Islam; publicly critcising brothers; always pushing some man-made 'solution' rather than the ways of Islam; accepting/owning/explaining terrorism like you were the voice of all Muslims; rude and insulting; lacking knowledge and all Islamic ettiquette of debate...
In my view MPAC harms Muslims, it isn't inspired or guided by Islam, and it only serves to promote what profits the State.

Millions now is it? Why not call it billions or gadzillions? That would be just as honest. Of course you are surely aware that the great majority of the dead civilian Muslims in Iraq and Afghanistan were killed by...other Muslims..? You did know that, didn't you? but that's OK, isn't it, because murders by Muslims are fine by you. Not really a crime at all in fact.
Thank you for demonstrating so clearly that my original comment was accurate.

I enjoyed reading this entry for its humanity. My only issues is it suggestion of blame on colonial powers as if we can do anything about it now. But we might also blame it on Arab conquests before that, Turkish imperialism, the crusades and so on. The trouble with blame is that it most often stops us taking peaceful action and planning a way out of the mess we are all in.

To quote the words of Martin Luther King - " The greatest purveyor of violence in the world today, is my own government(ie USA). Until we learn to disarm and de-escalate our war machine, we're going to be hated around the world."
This is why millions of Muslim and non Muslim hate the West - because of their propensity towards violence and terror, and their hypocrisy/double standards.

People, of all faiths and none are scandalised and shocked by this statement.

Listen up - 500,000 MUSLIM children were killed in Iraq even before the first bomb dropped - thanks to sanctions. That is one country alone and over a period of 10 years!

Do I have to add up the countries, wars and tyrants supporter before and after that?

As for Muslims killing muslims rubbish - when you take a system of government away and leave it to gangs and warlords what do you think they are going to do???

The question is who took the system away - in Somalia, in Afghanistan, in Iraq,

I wont even mention Palestine - and what your terrorist government is doing to us there, including starvation.

Excellent comment

Afraid to post the truth from your "sacred" texts, I see. I wonder why?

So much for "clarity."

This is why Muslims kill for Allah:

"the Messenger of Allah . . . would say: 'Fight in the name of Allah and in the way of Allah. Fight against those who disbelieve in Allah. Make a holy war. . . . When you meet your enemies who are polytheists, invite them to three courses of action. . . . Invite them to (accept) Islam; if they respond to you, accept it from them and desist from fighting against them. . . . If they refuse to accept Islam, demand from them the Jizya. If they agree to pay, accept it from them and hold off your hands. If they refuse to pay the tax, seek Allah's help and fight them . . .'" (Muslim Book 19, Number 4294).

"fight and slay the Pagans wherever ye find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war) . . . " (Qur’an 9:5).

"Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued" (Qur'an 9:29).

"Allah's Apostle said: 'I have been ordered (by Allah) to fight against the people until they testify that none has the right to be worshipped but Allah and that Muhammad is Allah's Apostle . . . '" (Bukhari Volume 1, Book 2, Number 24).

"It is not for any prophet to have captives until he hath made slaughter in the land. Ye desire the lure of this world and Allah desireth (for you) the Hereafter, and Allah is Mighty, Wise" (Qur'an 8:67).

“Allah’s Apostle said, ‘I have been made victorious with terror. The treasures of the world were brought to me and put in my hand’” (Bukhari Volume 4, Book 52, Number 220).

And here's a little something on little Aisha:

“My mother came to me while I was being swung on a swing between two branches and got me down. My nurse took over and wiped my face with some water and started leading me. When I was at the door she stopped so I could catch my breath. I was brought in while Muhammad was sitting on a bed in our house. My mother made me sit on his lap. The other men and women got up and left. The Prophet consummated his marriage with me in my house when I was nine years old” (Tabari 9:131).

“Narrated 'Aisha [Mohammed's six-year-old bride and nine-year-old sexual "partner"]: 'Allah's Apostle said (to me), "You were shown to me twice in (my) dream [before I married you]. Behold, a man was carrying you in a silken piece of cloth and said to me, 'She is your wife, so uncover her,' and behold, it was you. I would then say (to myself), 'If this is from Allah, then it must happen.'"'" (Bukhari Volume 9, Book 87, Number 139 and 140).

I don't get it. First of all you whine about millions of dead Muslims and use that as justification for terrorism, but fail to mention the fact that Muslims are the biggest killers of Muslims. It's not the just US troops killing kids and women in Baghdad Bazaars, it's Shia and Sunni nutcases.

It's not just the US troops killing women and children in Afghanistan - it's the Taliban trying to enforce their Sharia visions.

And lastly, the whining about someone's Israeli god... dude, do you realise that Allah/Hashem/Yahweh/God are all one and the same God? We all believe the same ****. Come on, wake up to yourself.

Stop insulting someone because of their religion and show some brain power.

And also,s top using the excuse that "we're killing you because you're killing us", because we can use that excuse on you too. And considering we target militant arseholes and you target women and children in bus shelters, this is not an argument you want to try get into.

That was a very poor choice of an example to illustrate the Muslim struggle. In fact, it was the path of non-violence that brought together the American people in trancending racism in our society. Were violence to have been undertaken by the black minority, firstly, it would have lost the conflict. Second, and more importantly, Barack Obama would not have just been elected President. Muslims are not oppressed in western societies - you are free to practice your religion, as long as you leave room for a secular space, according to western law.

As far as western imperial acts, the entire western world has walked away from imperialism, freeing all its colonies, territories and protectorates of its own volition - something previous empires never did. It seeks to negotiate peaceful settlement of the difficult grievances that remain. What we won't do is capitulate to the establishment of sha'ria or the extension of the barbaric caliphate around the world, which is the real agenda of the jihadists.

The jihadist agenda is clear for any sentient person to see - its leaders have laid it out in black and white. They confuse our hospitality and compassion for weakness at their peril, however. Hopefully you non-jihadists will find an accommodation with the west and separate yourselves from radical jihadis, going the way of Martin Luther King, not the way of Stokely Carmichael.

Saddam (the Muslim martyr lol)spent the oil money on gold taps and cars for his sons instead of food and medicine- and that's the fault of the West? You funny boy.
And you just can't help yourself, can you- Muslims killing Muslims in their tens of thousands in Iraq just doesn't count, because..er, well because they're not kaffirs, so their crimes mustn't even be acknowledged.
The stink of your hypocrisy is overpowering.
"My" government is the government of the UK, since I am a British citizen, so i don't know what the end of your little rant was about.

Don't mention Palestine - it's a good idea, because that used to be my government.

And I can tell you who was our worst enemy: other Arabs.

My family fled from the advancing Israeli army in 1947 because my father thought they would kill us. We settled in a refuge tent in Gaza.

All I can remember (I was 4 or 5 years old) was that as the Egyptians retreated, a bunch of soldiers surrounded our tents. A soldier entered ours. He raped my sister in front of my eyes and shot my dad in the abdomen.

My dad survived only because the advancing Israeli Army had doctors - he was taken to an Israeli field hospital and stitched up. Then he was offered to be taken to an Israeli hospital until he was 100% back on his feet. They even allowed us to go and live near the hospital for a while - and we were their enemies.

About 5 or 5 years later my sister committed suicide because no Arab man would take her as his wife after the rape.

In all my life in Gaza, my father, never once told me of a time when Israel would be seen without having been provoked by our own Arab militants. What he did tell me was that as our politicians drove out of their Mansions and Palaces on their Mercedes with entourages of hundreds, was that they were driving and living on money contributed by the West for ordinary Palestinians to live on. Instead we relied on Israel for everything - gas, water, economy, roads, fuel, electricity. Our government did absolutely nothing for us, whatsoever, and in every situation tried to make our lives worse.

So don't talk to me about Palestine. It used to be my country, but personally, I have suffered far more under Arab rule than under anyone or anywhere else.

lol you could not make it up! - a zionist now pretending he is a palestinian who loves the israeli's ..... please shut the F***** up!

We ALL know how zionists infiltrate and lie to the goy but this is just such a cheap scam and so obviously written by a zionist dog you have to laugh

You Zionist moron! - and yes i am a real Palestinian!

Dont see you getting of your fat Butt and doing anything,
you are obviously upset because of your contentment that it is not your family members that are having their limbs torn to shreds through evil barbarians that have invaded OR occupying other peoples lands,
the fact that you took out time to make these insulting comments about an organisation that feels the pain of its fellow muslims Worldwide makes me alittle upset to say the least..
i know you have a comfort zone that you do not want to leave,because lets face you have but denounced Islam..maybe its time you actually read about whats going on in this world,even if your current lifestyle inhibits you looking past your own nose..if you cant be part of the solution stop being part of the problem and push off

lol@scribbler,
why do they call you scribbler?it hasn't got anything to do with you being a retard has it?i mean you just SCRIBBLE all types of nonsense that frankly is nothing short of drivvle,maybe its time you take your doses of prozac and evaluate your life..
your obviously well versed on Islam the religion of peace,i say that because you seem to have a thing for this concocted word jihadist,sorry can you in your own words explain what it means?
I am under the impression that you need to be sectioned..
Jihad comes from the root word Juhadda which is striving OR struggling(which obviously you already know,dont you?),so im trying to work out the context that you are using this word in..

you wake up in the morning,thats jihad,you struggle to get to work on time,thats jihad..you play with your kids when all you want to do is go sleep,thats jihad..are you getting my drift hombre?please educate yourself before contemplating educating others

in the words of the famous "BART SIMPSON".."EAT MY SHORTS"

YOU ARE DESPICABLE!what do you mean Palestine used to be your country,it still is your country ,Silly, remember the zionists are the scumbags..lol...*CANT BE FOOLED*

No Islam does not teach this...However Islam does talk about struggling against oppression!

BTW..how did you like the quotes from the bible?

MPAC you guys rock!keep up the good work

I'm despicable for telling the truth about how a Muslim Arab raped my sister and shot my father and how the Israelis restored my father to health, looked after us with their own money, took nothing from us?

You have some nerve, I'll give you that.

Palestine is not my country. For a start, it's not legally a country, and even if it ever was, my country is where I now live and where I will bring up my kids. And I will make sure they hear my story of the good Muslims who destroyed our lives and the bad Israelis who gave us some hope for the future, and provided us with everything we needed, even as our government took everything from us except our dignity and our right to think for ourselves.

Thanks, slick, I loved the quotes from the Bible, now let me put them in context for you. The Law of Moses expressed in the Hebrew Bible was a harsh but just condemnation of sinful humans by God. The Bible also says, "There is no one righteous, not even one," and we are so sinful that we need the righteous Word of God to illuminate our wrong living and convict us of our rebelliousness. So, yes, in the Hebrew Bible, our Old Testament, a number of sins like homosexuality, adultery, and even disobedience were punished by death because they are truly repugnant to our just and wise God (even if our modern culture tolerates or even encourages them, but that's another topic). But, sir, that was the Old Testament. Thanks be to God, we ARE NOT commanded to execute sinners as you implied and as islamic jurisprudence demands even today! If we were, we would all be dead, because all of us are truly despicable sinners (yes, even muslims). We have a NEW TESTAMENT that makes us righteous in God's eyes, a NEW COVENANT with God established in and through the precious Blood of Jesus Christ: "This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference, for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus. God presented him as a sacrifice of atonement, through faith in his blood." I'm glad you found the Old Testament quotes, and I pray that the Holy Spirit leads you to understand their context in God's wonderful plan of redemption.

I'm trying to figure out if the people who are shouting against this video, even watched it. LOL.

The dude on the video, is explaining how it happens, why it happens etc. He isn't justifying anything but explaining why people rise up against tyranny.

That if you fight, control, do these things with violence, then you get violence back.

I mean come on, look around you, for centuries. That's exactly what has happened. When occuppiers, or tyrant rulers, or countries that go in with full guns, planes, bombs, then they get fought back with other means, and then they start using the same MEANS the occuppiers or tyrants, or other countries used against them.

What is so difficult to understand? It's a fact.

The problem here is people in UK or USA, in their pretty homes, who got homes, who never get dragged from their homes, do not know emotionally or anything to what happens.

They use rationale, emotional thinking instead of seeing from other point of view.

Like..

"If someone went now, and slapped your wife in the face. Or someone punched your daughter. Or someone went to your own mother's house, here in uk, and they put bullet holes in them and the system did nothing even when you complained, even when you got evidence, what are you going to do?"

You're going to do what people? I like to do from those who are shouting about..

"Oh Violence means etc.."

What would you do. I'd like an honest answer here because you cannot really speak up with righteousness behind your nice warm carpeted homes, or your nice jobs, or your everyday without one plight of war on you or rape from soldiers, or someone bull dozed your house, or from without any soldier walking into your home, bangs a hole in it and slaps and headbutts your wife.

Heck, most of you speak as though you got your home bull dozed yourself and speak so calmly.

You, all of you, would rise up and you would do what you HATE the most. Fight back instead of cower and talk so intelligently on how wrong it is to do so.

At least be honest when you debate people. At least have that decency to see the video, for what it is, and look it with a smart mind and learn from what it is saying.

It is showing the truth of what happens if you think you can quash war with war, violence with violence. And you cannot talk about peace, liberation while in other hand bomb the heck of people's lives, homes, rape their daughters which some USA soldiers have done, and enough pictures of what they have done.

You cannot talk about liberation after you give billions to Isreal and continue to support Isreal without justice, and being apologetic and fall into the sympathy of gas chamber haloacausts.

"If someone went now, and slapped your wife in the face. Or someone punched your daughter. Or someone went to your own mother's house, here in uk, and they put bullet holes in them and the system did nothing even when you complained, even when you got evidence, what are you going to do?"

You're going to do what people? "

Blame the muslims because statistically it will almost certainly be them who did it.

Many millions were displaced by partition in India, but we all settled down and got on with life. 200,000 palestinians were displaced and they are still belly-aching about it 60 years later.

And nothing whatsoever will ever please them.

But are you saying that the non-muslim should not meet muslim violence with violence? What is your solution? That we all surrender?

Jesus Christ said he had not come to change the laws of god but rather to fulfill,you obviously missed that..and can you confirm are you the lost sheep of "Israel"

You really are something else...who do thing you are kidding matey,put some effort into covering up your BS Palestine will always be your country,dont deny it and do not be a silly zionist lover*laughs*zionists are evil tyrants,your forefathers are muslims..come back to their faith

Slickafoe seems to think that all Palstinians are Muslims - wrong.

Secondly, he seems to think that if an ancestor was from a particular country, one will always be "from" that country - wrong.

Thirdly, he cannot accept that a Muslim might realise that Islam is mistaken and wish to leave (without being killed - its good over here isn't it?)

If Palestine did not exist you would have to invent it. The world has moved on - get used to it.

Of course you won't, you admire the bombers You think Muslim terrorism is always justified, everywhere. You regard all Muslims as incapable of wrongdoing because they're all in your club. You censor all opposing views where you can and try to shout them down where you can't censor. You regard kaffirs as subhuman. You are fascist religious psychopaths.

You must be talking about the Israeli bombers who later became your prime minister??

Or the barbaric religious psychopaths who ethnically cleansed the Palestinian people?

Am I clear on what you were getting at? Im sure MPAC could not be supporting them, as they are anti Zionist killers?

What a load of rubbish Zionists are killing or expelling everyone who is not Jewish ..

and the world has not moved on - you have .. get back to reality.

Slick, good to hear from you again, I hope you are well. First, let me clear up a minor misunderstanding. I never claimed to be among the "lost 'sheep' of Israel." I'm Irish-American and proud of it. I've been a Christian my whole life, and very grateful to God for that. Can I assume you are a follower of Mohammed?

No, I didn't miss the part about Jesus Christ coming to fulfill the Law. But you are correct in this sense: if the Law of God was changed (which seems to be a logical impossibility anyway) then Christ's atoning sacrifice on the Cross for all of us would have been meaningless and unnecessary. Slick, you have to look at the Old Testament law, and consider all the penalties that you owe, for all the sins you have committed, and understand that if you tried as hard as you could for a hundred years to avoid sin and do good in the earth, you still wouldn't have paid back one billionth of the debt you owe to God for your rebellion. Same for me, same for everybody. Jesus Christ fulfilled the Law by taking on that awful debt for every single person in the world. Why? Because God loved us when we were still sinners. That is the fulfillment that Christians thank God for.

No, I believe you publically call the leaders of all these fanctions to meet. You then get them to agree that we deal with who is doing what. You have to look at what is happening, who is doing and if it is really CIA etc, or someone causing some stirr.

If they do not agree, then...

You FIGHT. That's when you give a warning that from now on, you're going to fight back.

I'm a British atheist, so I have no idea what you're raving about. What is clear is that MPAC have decided to drop their pretence and come out in public support of Muslim terrorism, be it in London or Mumbai. "We will not condemn". Well, the rest of us know where MPAC stands now.

Thats cheeky since your support of the biggest terrorist state in the world 'Israel' classifies you as a terror suspect of the world.

For those that do not know, Israel committed over a million terror attacks in lebanon this summer.

Talking nonsense as usual,you do not follow jesus rather you follow the author of the new testament Paul,you seem to forget that Paul was a CHRISTIAN HATER/bounty hunter who on the road to Damascus discovered Jesus,how exactly I do not know...He was never a disciple neither was Mathew,Mark ,Luke and John.. I dont believe Jesus died...please check out Ahmed Deedat rendition on The Real Jesus Christ,not Paul who some of you are followers of..

How does detesting Muslim terrorists and despising their MPAC Student Grant cheerleaders make me a supporter of Israel? explain please.

happykaffy the fact that you ignore daily terrorism by jews-christians and hindus but are to hapy to condemn muslims proves you are a supporter of kaffir terrorism.
it is odd people calling themselves atheists love condemning muslims but become quiet when kaffirs are involved.
colin the atheist closet zionist being a prime example of this hypocrisy.

Slick wrote, "I dont believe Jesus died" Well, why not? Did Mohammed die? Do you think that Jesus did not die because He was too holy? If that were true, then where would that leave Mohammed, who did die? But that is all just hot air, Slick. Let me ask you this: What's going to happen when YOU die? If Jesus did not die to cover the sin-debt we all owe to God -- if He didn't die to fulfill the Law for us -- then we are all screwed. As I posted before, our sins are so numerous and so offensive to God that we can't pay that debt ourselves, no matter how hard we try. So ... what's left? Only Jesus.

Slick, I'm sorry, I was in a hurry, and I left out a couple of other comments that I pray you will consider. Jesus didn't die? He knew in advance that he was going to die, and as the Old Testament prophets foretold, He entered His Passion "meek as a lamb before the shearer." He told His apostles in advance that he would be crucified. The whole point of God's redemptive plan was for Jesus to die for you and me. Then He proved His divine nature by conquering death, by rising up from His grave. Many people have trouble understanding the complexity of this Jesus -- that He can be both human and divine -- but the things of God, are they not beyond our understanding? Paul "discovered" Jesus on the road to Damascus, and yes, this fanatic hater of Jesus was turned in a flash (literally) into a lover and follower of our Lord, and God used him in powerful ways to testify primarily to the Gentile world. Let me ask you this: does God use exploding muslims to testify to His grace and mercy? Where did Jesus command His followers to slay His enemies? Or did you miss the part where He commanded us to love even our enemies? How about the part where He healed the servant of the high priest, after one of the apostles had sliced off his ear? In one of your earlier posts you mentioned that "Islam does talk about struggling against oppression." In light of Jesus' words and actions, do you think He would approve of "struggling against oppression" with suicide bombers and rockets and murder?

"No, I believe you publically call the leaders of all these fanctions to meet. You then get them to agree that we deal with who is doing what. You have to look at what is happening, who is doing and if it is really CIA etc, or someone causing some stirr.

If they do not agree, then...

You FIGHT. That's when you give a warning that from now on, you're going to fight back."

As your faction is a small percentage of the 3% of the UK who are Muslims, it is guaranteed that you will loose any vote.

So, do I understand correctly - the kafirs will be obliged to fight back and thats ok with you?

Duh, this is a Muslim site, stupid boy. Moreover it is a Muslim site run by and infested with wannabee-but-not-quite-brave-enough jihadis like yourself, cheering on your Muslim brothers and sisters as they detonate themselves on Tubes and buses. The duty of decent people is to oppose them and you.

I do not see you condemning the apartheid Israel and its antics.I further dont see you condemning America and her allies for orchestrating countless Illegal wars that have left millions of innocent people dead,or attrocities in this world that are commited in other than Islam..do you really go on other websites(NON MUSLIM)and condemn them?nah..didn't think so

You really are an ignorant brainwashed turd face zionist dumbass scumbag aren't you..Islam condemns killing of innocent people,unlike your zionist pigs who have no respect for law and violate them endlessly,your lot don't even honour the geneva convention or the UN..is because we are goyim's?stop following the TALMUD and come back to the TORAH..Imbecile

Orly, I'd check my facts if I were you.

Israel's Muslim population is growing. I invite you to read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_citizens_of_Israel with select quotes from Muslim scholars who confirm the fact for you.

I also encourage you to understand that Zionists aren't invading or killing anyone differently to what Muslims doing.

You say that they are terrorists because they kill Lebanese and Palestinians. Yet Palestinians and Lebanese kill Jews and you expect them to not retaliate when we would.

In essence, what the MPACUK supporters are doing here is calling everyone who disagrees with them, Nazis, Zionist-lovers or Jews. It's a straw-man argument for a start, and simply intellectually dishonest for a second point.

They also support killing Jews because of Israeli "oppression" but do not support Jews killing them because of Muslim aggression towards Jews.

I put one last thing to you, about the racism of my former religion. The Mumbai terror attacks by Muslim gunmen targeted a Rabbi who was part of the Neturei Karta organisation which rejects Zionism and the right of Israel to exist. You can read about them here: http://www.nkusa.org

These Muslim terrorists executed a Rabbi who was not a Zionist, nor was interested in the continuation of the existence of the state of Israel. Muslims killed an ally. And they killed him because he was Jewish. So please, don't bother trying to convince me that Islam is only against Zionism, otherwise there would be no dead Jews in Mumbai.

Slickafoe wrote: "I do not see you condemning the apartheid Israel and its antics.I further dont see you condemning America and her allies for orchestrating countless Illegal wars that have left millions of innocent people dead,or attrocities in this world that are commited in other than Islam..do you really go on other websites(NON MUSLIM)and condemn them?nah..didn't think so." Slick, happy to see that you are still engaged here. First, I haven't "condemned" anybody, or at least any country or nationality or religion. Not my job. Hate to break bad news to you, but NOBODY is getting into heaven on the strength of their nationality or ethnicity or whatever. We are all judged on the basis of what is in our hearts individually, and the actions that our hearts lead us to take to express the love of God. So whether America or Israel or Iran or whatever is the more corrupt is irrelevant. Yes, we can and should work to make the world a more just place, but your work will bear much greater fruit if it is based on reality and when it involves individuals.

"Countless illegal wars ... millions of innocent people dead"? That sounds awful. Could you name off, say, 10 illegal wars "orchestrated" by USA? Let's please be specific, since reality and specificity go so well together.

When you get right down to it, talking about what has already happened is kind of useless. And, no, I'm not just trying to minimize an inconvenient past. But we live in the present, Slick. And we can never get past the past, if we as individuals and as nations keep looking for "revenge" or even "justice against oppression." Let me give you an example. If I understand aright, the Israelis left a pretty sophisticated and productive hydroponic farming system in place when they pulled back from Gaza some time ago. That system is no longer usable. The Gazans were so focused on attacking Israel that they tore those systems down so they could use those areas for their attacks. How much sense does that make? And, okay, how about when one of the islamic jihad groups talks about "crusaders". Give it a rest, Slick, the crusades were almost a thousand years ago! If you want justice, look to God: "Vengeance is mine, saith the Lord." Let go and let God. If we all did that, probably 90% of the violence in this world would stop.

Does your Mummy know you use that kind of language? Your (entirely justified) inferiority complex is so strong that you think anyone more articulate than you (more or less everyone) must be Jewish. Truly pathological. Like I said, I'm a British atheist,and I have physical proof. I suggest you stop following 9th century fairy sories and come into the real world.