I think its clear that MPACUK were condemning the sufis working for Policy Exchange because they are sell-outs, not because they are sufis. Sufi Muslim Council is giving Sufism a bad name - it's right that MPAC should expose them and their allies. It's really important to emphasise that sectarianism has no place in our community - and as the writer points out MPAC have spoken out strongly against sectarianism, and I hope they will continue to make this clear.

IH - my duas for the success of your hard work reforming the mosque

MPACUK need to be clearer that they are not against Sufis, but are totally against Neocon Sufis!

I really don't know where any sufi who read everything MPACUK wrote and said, would believe that MPAC spoke against Sufism.

I've read every article they put out and warnings on sell outs regarding this and not once did they say they are against the Sufis but rather the attitude and the working relationshion with the Neocons.

And if they are smart, the Sufi brothers and sisters better go out in the street, to every cafe, to every mosque, to every centre and whatever Muslims are, and they will realise one thing:

1. Their relationship with Bush, doesn't put them in a good face with Muslims around the world.

2. They have isolated themselves and now their complaining? What do you expect? Of course they made one big error and personally, they went out there and began saying, "we represent the Muslim community and we are better representatives than the rest."

Hey, they made their bed, now lie in it.

3. So, this article is irrelevant because MPAC, from what I read, didn't say jack against Sufism but rather the approach, their dealings with certain government officials and the way they come through back door and begin their suspiciou dealings.

I wont trust that organisation and nor would many Muslims today because they are so close in working with the Neocons.

Plain and simple, that Sufi organisation SOLD OUT. You hear me writer? That organisation sold out period and MPAC said jack against Sufism.

So conclusion:

MPAC was condeming the activities, the workings, the partnership, the ongoing back stab plannings within the Sufi Council with the Noecons.

Bring forth, what MPAC said about Sufis and let's see, and we will see as the audience and surfer of the forum, that nothing there that dicates MPAC against SUFIS.

I do admire the letter and in its heartfelt message but you should be aiming your words at the hypocrisy of the Sufi Council.

Have a look at the the major Muslim players in government schemes and you will the big "murids" the shaykh in Jordon. For example check out City Circle, the other day they has an article from the Zio-Con Douglas Murray on their website. Do you know who is the director of City Circle???

The lines in the original article of MPAC have blurred the view of myself towards the ideology of MPAC, the article was written in a way that will make people re-question what they had always thought of MPAC. I totally agree with Ali- Abdullah the poster above on this issue.

Where is the articulated response to the publication of the policy exchange? Is there one forthcoming?

I think that an article by MPAC UK disproving the Policy Exchange report in its entirety would be a great kudos to MPAC UK and establish its credentials amongst the Muslim Community.

Wich article was thehook reading

The very first paragraph talks about sufi cults and not a particular group or people

The second paragraph deals with actions of Sufi cults abroad in an incorrect historical context. And asks “ anyone guess who they are?” if this is only about 8 people and not all sufis why ask this question

The third paragraph talks of an organisation and again place the beliefs of that organisation on all sufis

Sufism is not a cult it is apart of islam and to refer to it as such shows the intent of the writer ( look up the word cult)

Time and time again Sufism is attacked in the first paragraph Sufism is mocked

Mpack need to offer an apology for this

I think its about time Muslims start to realise whether anyone approves or disapproves the creed and methodology of “Sufism” (and its various orders) from a theological point it is not the issue here – the issue is - regardless of whether Sufis recognise it or not – politically (in the interests of Muslims)- these “great sufi shaykhs” as the author of the letter wrote are also regarded or will be regarded as “great (Islamic) Scholars of our time” by Neo-Cons and Zionists - because of the manifestation of Sufism suits the Neo-Con/Zionist agenda – the manifestation of pacifism, defeatism, cowardice, being apolitical, and nurturing youth as sleepy Zombies.

This is why we find Western governments, Neo-Cons and Zionists actively supporting, or funding Sufi organizations in order to spread its ideological influence within the Muslim community.

It is a reality today – whether anyone likes it or not – Sufism hurts the interests of the Muslims.

maybe mainstream sufis who are ideologically not that distant from any other mainstream muslim and who are not part of the zionist-neo conservative bandwagon should disassociate themselves more vociferously from the likes of the sufi muslim council and those that served policy exchange in their recent deceits against islam and muslims in the uk.

it is not mpac that is doing a disservice to muslims and islam but those that have become zionists within the muslim community.

(zionists - a political grouping that pervert articles of faith for political and personal gain at the expense of truth).

Maybe "Reality" is just a preception

Reality the things you ascribe to the shhyukh are just simply not true. i have had the honour of studying from some of these shyukh and they do not promote pacifism defeatism cowardice etc and to say they do is nothing short of slander.

Have you yourself actually ever heard the shyukh mentioned in the letter actually promote anything you have said.

i certainly havnt and i have spent a considrable amount of time with some of them and my experience is similar to the author, i know Qibla Pirzada and Shaikh hamza yusuf definatly promote poitical paticipation as do the others.

MPACUK always says they are acountable to the public but they still havnt clarified thier position on sufis as, has been asked by the public.

If the Shyukh or what ever you call them were so amazing and active how comes hardly any Sufi's are out there defending the Ummah in the UK?

Most of them in my area never lift a finger when it comes to doing anything, but they are the first to sit in some pointless gathering with their - Shayukh!

In responce to post 10:

I believe - you may have missed the point I tried to make - it is not about what they promote or teach (which is another issue in it self)- but rather what is manifested from it either intentionally or un-intentionally and in most cases it may be the latter - many Sufis may be sincere in their way of life but it does not disregard the observation that Sufis tend to be pacifists and defeatists whether this is intended or not - we need to look at the bigger picture - if one chooses to pursue the path of Sufism and become rooted in it secluding oneself from society, busing oneself with excessive rituals etc and all in the name of undertaking the "greater Jihaad" then that is ones choice (whether this is Islamicly correct or not is another issue) - but if one billion Muslims one day decide to do the same thing - then we have a big problem in our hands,

And this is what is a danger to the revival, security, well-being and interests of the Muslims - which the Neo-Cons and Zionists seem to have recognized and I believe Muslims need to realize too

Muslims who are in tune with current affairs will recognize that Neo cons and Zionists are waging an intense vicious war on Islam - it is a fact, and it is disturbing to say the least that if one flicks through the various think-tank reports produced by policy makers such as from the RAND Corporation and others other than them - post 9/11 - one will see a key component in their agenda to maintain western hegemony and dominance over the Muslim World and the minority communities within the West - is the active promotion of Sufism.

If we look at our Muslim community here in Britain - although we may have many problems but we are seeing more and more young Muslims becoming observant of the Faith, and this is coupled together with the fact that more Muslims are becoming more educated, professional and affluent with good jobs and positions of influence and our community is growing and this is also reflected in Europe - the last thing we need is our communities to be steered towards Sufism at the pleasure of Neo-Cons and Zionists that damages our interests - the interests of Muslims in Britain of being a strong, vibrant, influential community that is active in pursuing in securing and expanding our interests here and abroad that has impact and achieves results which also benefits the wider society at large and furthers the cause of Islam.

With regards to the "great scholars of out time" such as the likes of Hamza Yusuf one only needs to ask the dedicated enemy of Islam - the Pharaoh of this time who has blood of over a million Muslims on his hands - George W Bush of his opinion of Hamza Yusuf (who happened to be one if his "Islamic advisors" just after 9/11) and will recognize the point I am trying to make.

In my view - when the enemies of Islam who viciously wage war on Islam and the Muslims promote certain "Islamic scholars” or “personalities” and see them as the “good guys” the “true Muslims”, “the Moderates”, “the ideal Muslim” - know there is something definitely wrong with them.