so when are mpac going to start a campaign of complaint against monarch?

why did the pilot choose to remove the INNOCENT asians however did not consider leaving those irrational people that would not board behind?

Clearly the pilots have some questions to answer for the way they encouraged the suspicion and by default found the INNOCENT asians guilty.

It appears as noted elsewhere the men were guilty of being asian. nothing more.

Do we have to thank reid and blair for the hype and fear tactics they are using to further their political goals in the Mideast?

I think so.

I have posted my comment on the BBC. It is outrageous, as Wendy pointed out. What are we going to do about this ?

Customer Relations, Monarch Airlines, London Luton Airport, Luton, Bedfordshire LU2 9NU

I have sent an email, unfortnately, the Monarch web page has a general enquiry page link. But I have kept my comments quite simple enquiring what languages can a passenger speak and what languages are banned - well I know Arabic is, Its a good thing Monarch Airlines don't fly to the Middle East I guess they wouldn't have any passengers.

The hypocrisy of english people is just amazing.

On a trip back from Turkey recently they would have the nerve to stare at non whites and point fingers but when some rowdy white englsh people would start swearing and behave like hooligans on the flight its not an issue.

Racism is alive and kicking and hitler blair and stalin John reid are just making the issue worse with their gulity untill proven statements against muslims.

I am afraid that the asian community, rather the moslim community, has induced this sort of fear amongst the ordinary folk who live in Great Britain. All asians who are muslims are suspects now. You have created the fact that religion rules your world even though you are living in a secular society. You do not seem to be able to live in a secular society because all we hear in the media and news is the word 'muslim' which is a religion. The christians, jews, anglicans etc in this country do not go around constantly stating their religion. The 'moslim' community has done nothing to stop this pervasive infiltration into the news, therefore all asians are considered moslims and potential 'terrorists'. You cannot stop that now. It is not up to our government to do anything at all about that. Its up to your people to sort yourselves out, otherwise return to your homeland where you will be able to practice what you like.

a shameful disgrace. The airline has a lot to answer for.

This is the effect of Blair and the Labour Party anti-islam foreign policies by creating hysteria against anyone who is non-white and especially 'islamic' looking (just look at how bnp have flourished under the labour party in power).

It is the easist vote winner for any inept and morally defunct politician and is an opportunity to win hearts and minds of the decent white majority by saying we will not let these nasty muslims get you and your children we will make sure that you are safe with us.

I partly agree with Didi, but would point out that for many many Muslims, the UK IS their homeland. They were born here, and have both a right to be here, and a duty to making the UK a better place. Being 'British' and 'Muslim' are not mutually exclusive.

Further to this, if Asians starting packing up and going back to the place of their familial origin, the UK would be a poorer place, because most Asians contribute positive things to the UK, and we all benefit from your presence here.

However, I would agree that there is a great deal that is wrong with modern multicultural Britain.

This is because when ‘multiculturalism’ is just about different religions, foods, languages etc, then the differences between us are interesting and exciting, and it is therefore interesting and enjoyable to hear my children coming home telling me that they learnt about Eed and Ramadam in school from a local Immam, and that they now have a better understanding of their Muslim school friends a result (just as it is to hear them talk about their learning about Passover and a visit to a local synagogue).

However, when multiculturalism is about a ‘clash’ of cultures, about a difference of values over things like gay/women’s rights, the rights of people to enjoy a secular democratic form of governance, and the values of the Enlightenment (upon which our society has been based for nearly 300 years), we feel threatened and angered. This is compounded by the recent rise in what is now known as ‘Global Islamo-Fascism’ – the rise of those who wish to impose Islamic values, religious practices and forms of governance by force rather than through discourse and dialogue.

The blame for this current situation can be shared out among a number of circumstances.

Firstly, successive governments - particularly those of 30 years ago - allowed Asians to feel insecure and unwelcome in the UK, and fuelled the need for Asians to herd themselves together in inner city locations. Governments have therefore allowed areas with high populations of Asians to become effective ghettoes, where white Brits feel a minority, and eventually leave. There are places in London where schools have white British student populations of under 10%, and where white British people genuinely feel 'strangers in their own land' (which breeds resentment). But the Asian communities - particularly second generation Asians - have not done enough to integrate into mainstream UK society (such as ensuring children are fluent in English as well as Urdu, Parsi, Arabic, Hindi etc), and many British people - who ae increasingly secular in their outlook - feel that whilst they have a duty to defend Asians from racism, that none the less, Asian communities are equally guilty of their own types of prejudice, such as homophobia, distrust of white people, attitudes towards women which to many from my background are at best patronising and at worst, out of the middle ages!

The outcome of this is that whilst a few years, the diversity of our national life was something we used to celebrate, it is now something that the (white) majority are starting to ask questions about, such as:

1. If we tolerate Asian religious and cultural freedoms, why do many Asians (seemingly) refuse to respect our ways of life - especially in our country?

2. Is it right that we should tolerate constant denigration of our liberal secular values that have contributed so much to the development of our society by ethnic and religious minorities who fully accept the benefits of living in our liberal secular society (the right to free health care/education/welfare state, a free press, housing, and 'general' freedom from tyranny etc) which are benefits they would NOT enjoy in the places of their familial origins - and yet use these benefits to undermine the very society which supports them?

3. Why do those Asians who genuinely integrate and prosper in modern British culture seem to be considered as having ‘sold out’ by their fellow Asians? For example, why was Sajit Mahmood booed and insulted by fellow ‘British Asians’ simply because he was playing cricket for England – which is after all the country of his birth? Outrageous!!!

For many of us white secular types, the major question is why do so many Asians – and particularly Muslims - born in the UK and benefiting from their nationality, feel so little commitment to their homeland? This is the origin of the ‘why don’t you go home’ jibe. The trouble is, they are home, but seemingly refuse to recognise it or feel any commitment to their homeland. I understand both sides of the argument, as I am of Irish descent. I visit Ireland and love the place, and always feel a kind of ‘spiritual’ home in the place of my origins. But I was born British, and feel proud to be so. I enjoy many benefits from my birth and feel I have a responsibility to my country – to defending it, its values, culture(s) and bettering its future.

If Asians genuinely feel that home is Asia, then perhaps they should try living there for a while, amongst the poverty, disease, lack of access to social support and health care. Perhaps then they would recognise the benefits of their British nationality and start working to make Britain a better place rather than simply denigrating it. In other words, its time for the Asian communities to take their rightful place as part of the solution, and not part of the problem!

I just tried ringing Monarch to complain but couldn't get through so I've sent an email via their website and posted a formal letter of compaint saying that unless they issue an apology and a guarantee that it would not be repeated I would never consider booking with them. If you ever want to be able to get on an aeroplane again I suggest you to do the same!
Customer Relations Department
Monarch Airlines
Prospect House
Prospect Way
London Luton Airport
Luton
Bedfordshire
LU2 9NU

"Clearly, we can't have a situation where one passenger decides that another passenger isn't going to fly,"What nonsense from David Reynolds, BALPA spokesman. If he meant what he said he the airplane's captain would have supported the Asians' right to fly against the bigotry and hysteria of the rest!Not to attribute too much credit to Reynold's use of English but he is suggesting that the two Asians, by dint of their appearance, "decided" that other passengers weren't to fly!A typical Freudian slip on his part revealing his own inherent racist bias about who really was responsible for preventing the flight.This is what all ethnic groups are faced with in Bliar's Brave New Britain: a deeply ingrained racism and xenophobic bigotry.Let us no longer appease it and make excuses for it like earlier generations did. Let's deal with it head-on once and for all.Every incident like this should be challenged. After all, Jewish and Zionist organizations do and look how successful they have been!

If this is the way air companies are going to run their business why bother with airport security checks, the company should have informed the passengers we have made our security checks and these passengers ahve complied with our criteria i fyou do no t wish to travel on this plane your tickets will be cancelled and you will have to purchase tickets again, ifeel the two people in question should sue the company involved for humiliating them because of their skin colour.

if we are going to run a racial aparthied in this country based on allegations then since the majority of paedophiles are white should we refuse to have our children educated by white teachers as they are left alone with them for 6 or 7 hours a day in schools and care centres.

should we when ever we see a christian person be alert to the fact that he might try to rob us and kill us if we resist, since the muslim countries are being invaded and ocupied by christian nations.

Wendy,

Perhaps you should blame the terrorists for this 'climate of fear'?

I have often wondered what I would do, if I felt that somebody was acting suspiciously on a tube/bus/plane. I think the passengers did the right thing.

If they had sat there worrying about the men (but too worried of being labelled a 'racist' to do anything about it), who exactly would have protected them once in the air?

The only person that is going to save you from a terrorist on the tube/bus/plane is *you*. You might not like facing facts, but luckily other people have thought about it and have decided that the safety of themselves and their families, come before any PC notion of 'fairness'.

I hope that I'm brave enough to speak out, if the time ever comes.

wendy mann

The buck stops with you, me and people like us.

MPAC can do as you said but how many people are supporting MPAC to make them more efficient and effective.

I recently learned that full time MPAC volunteers have to go back to work just so they can fund MPAC activities. It really got to me.

How many so-called angered Muslims are throwing a helping line to MPAC for championing the Islamic cause?
There has to be a day when MPAC can say we can take on the Zionist machine, the Islamaphbic, the racist the anti Islamic and beat them at their own game and it is all because of Muslim donation. And show this country that we are not a cheap and ignorant people. We will take the fight to them and not wait to be beaten before we even had a chance to wake up.

It is not as if they are asking for blood for God’s sake just look at the Zionists and see what support they are getting making them the most powerful lobbyist in the world

Just like the Zionists they need to put up full time professionals to work with volunteers to make a difference.

I ran a company and I know that just for paper and pens you need to budget for never mind the other things.
I really wonder how MPAC is managing to get long with so little support

Tel your family, friends and colleagues to donate money or volunteer their skills or just give up a bit of their time ANYTHING.

If Muslims genuinely feel that home is an Islamic country, then perhaps they should try living there for a while, amongst the poverty, disease, lack of access to social support and health care. Perhaps then they would recognise the benefits of their British nationality and start working to make Britain a better place rather than simply denigrating it. In other words, its time for the Muslim communities to take their rightful place as part of the solution, and not part of the problem!

Monarch should have insisted those passengers who were refusing to fly with these men on board make their own arrangements to get home, if the two were posing no threat to aircraft safety. We cant just pick and choose who our fellow passengers are -clearlu this lot would be screwed if they ever need to transit through the middle east!

However Waq should realise that Asians/Muslims are hardly immune to being racist or just simply rude. I've spent many years travelling in South Asia and have had a plentiful share of unprovoked finger pointing, sniggers and snide, abusive and insulting remarks in a language the brown racists thought I couldn't understand - something I quickly put them right on.

Racism is not a one way street. Minorities in any country will get some flak from bigots who say more about themselves than about their victims with their facile behaviour. Two wrongs dont make a right, and some of the remarks here from Muslims on racism in the UK prove that they are just as moronic, backward and fascist as those they 'criticise'. The loudest voices are always those heard most often by the majority, and Muslims should hardly be surprised they have a negative image if they fail to challenge the brainless racists in their own ranks.

Whilst it is a disgrace to chuck people off the planes for being muslims, are you really suprised that people are jumpy after the arrests and subsiquent charging of those radical muslims who were trying to murder 4000 air travelers?

MPACK, the MCB and the rest of the muslim groups appear to be in denial of the damage radicals in your midst do to relations with the Majority in this country who are not muslims. I notice there is not ONE article here condeming what happened last week? Why not? How about that maniac in Manchester who basicallly said muslims should fight to change the UK into an islamic state (cause thats not going to upset the rest of non muslims in the UK is it!!!!!) .

Its all very good playing the victim , which you do I might say with perfection, however if muslisms as a community do not start doing something to integrate and cast out or at the very least disown the luncatics in your midst then expect more of the above, as we simply do not trust you.

Just to make a few points I wanted to make earlier. If I had been 'profiled' because of my skin colour/appearence, I don't think I'd be best pleased. I think I would feel insulted and upset - so I understand why Asians/Muslims feel this way.

But I do hope that Asians/Muslims understand that when this does happen, it isn't always a sign of underlying racism - just people responding to the current situation. Sadly, the biggest threat from terrorism at the moment is - whether we like it or not - posed by young Muslim men, therefore, attempts to prevent terrorism would be pointless if too many resorces were concetrated on groups outside this profile.

Therefore, when people see people who fit the profile acting 'supiciously', they feel worried and start panicking and becoming hysterical.

Hysteria spreads quickly, and airlines can be forgiven for responding to group hysteria.

However, please remember that, as annoying as it is for innocent and law abiding Muslims, airlines HAVE to act if someone reports suspicious behaviour, regardless of where that behaviour is seen. Afterall, the shoe bomber didn;t try to self detonate in the departure lounge, he did it on the airplane - i.e. he made it through security!

Finally, I think that now is the time for the Muslim community to show some understanding of the fear that many people feel, and stop accusing every person who has a concern about terrorism as 'a racist'!

Finally, there is obviously a problem within many Muslim communities, since the terrorists and would be bombers are all 2nd generation Muslims, born and raised in this country. Therefore, if Muslims wish to no longer be stereotyped by the behaviour of a minority of extremists, then they have to take them on head to head, condemn and defeat them - no 'ifs', no 'buts'!

If you 'tolerate' extremism within your ranks, or even allow the impression to rise that you tolerate or 'sympathise' or 'understand' or 'think they have a point', then you can expect to get a whole lot of grief from the baying mob who will not tolerate your tolerence of those who seek to kill us!

It isn't helped by pools and nes that a very worrying number of younf Muslims regards the suicide bombers as martyrs!

Alas, the work starts with the Muslim communities. Root out the terrorists, marginalise and defeat the terrorist ideologies, distance yourself and utterly condemn unequivacally acts of violence and then condemn profiling. Don't do that, expect more people to act hysterically.

Basil, Wendy and others

So what is the Islamic cause that you want to "champion". As adrian said we are a secular country and the non muslim population is not interested in a British minorities religous cause.

And at the moment most people would associate a religous cause with terrorism.

The British government will not base it's foreign policy on the religion of that country to appease all Muslims in this country. You assume that Muslims are never wrong.

Where was your Muslim cause when Indonesia was bombing christians in East Timor with UK supplied jets.

Dear Adrian

In reply to your questions

1. You posed a conjecture seemingly directed at Muslims, that of Respect. Please answer RESPECT to what aspect of “our way of life” do you refer to? I will appreciate a more precise admission. I await your reply

2. Quote, “use these benefits to undermine the very society which supports them”. Can you please elaborate how it is that Muslims do that?. I awit your reply.

3. Quote, “Outrageous!!!” thank you for this insight, which I share with you to a degree.

And yet is not outrageous that British Muslims are constantly shouted at as terrorist by Britain and the same institutions that you hold to so dearly (like your so called “free” press).
Which is worse booing your displeasure or inciting religious and racial hatred and fear amongst the wider community? I await your response and hope you would share in this outrage perpetrated against a people that have, as you correctly pointed out, contributed to this society.

As a free white person please allow the same freedom for people of all colours to boo you without condemning it as a universally agreed outrage.

MESSAGE TO THE DETRACTORS OF ISLAM

Hear you are.

Enjoy your freedom to be heard given to you by Muslim’s through an Islamic Website.

THE FREEDOM OF SPEECH

Look up the web site of the AIPAC the most powerful pro-Israel lobby and tell me if you can post your views on it. Nay you cannot.

Monarch Airlines Latest advert;

No Dogs, Irish, Blacks,
OR DODGY LOOKING FORIEGNERS NEED FLY WITH US


Boycott the racist bigots

TIME OUT FOLKS.

Why are we having a pot at each other.

The article is about 2 guys who had been treated unfairly. Rob London UK, you are more than welcome to scream what you like on a tube or a plane or even on your toilet seat. It makes no difference to me or anyone else.

Basil I'm glad you realised that the team on MPACUK are running on a shoestring budget but don't have a go at Wendy, click on the donation button and do something about it.

ROB: Save that anger and frustration and channel it on the Zionist articles on MPACUK.

Am I missing something but not one of you have made any comments or put your thoughts or views foward on the Palestanin articles or what the IDF are doing in Lebannon but when it comes to the home page we tend to comment like there is no tomorrow.

Remember MPACUK also is quite passionate about what happens in Palestine and Lebannon. Unlike the 2 persons who at the end did catch a flight, the people in Palestine are still suffering.

Al
In reply “champion the wonder horse” Sorry for being vague but read on and you would understand why.

The cause if you really want to know I recommend that you just open your eyes and see what fair-minded people see.

“Secular society” what does that mean since you have elected Adrian to be their spokes person. In case you fail to understand I am society irrespective of whatever title you please to label it.

You say “Most people” would associate religious cause with terrorism. What do you mean by “MOST”, how many, can you quantify this word authoritatively and supply your source? Special interest Lobbyist and big donors and shape gov. policies not you or me. MPAC will get there not a moment to soon.

Now you are the self-elected spokesman of these “most people” who ever these people are you are not telling us.

The British gov. is just that British and should reflect British views and as we are British I feel our views must count irrespective of what religion we follow.

East Timor Christians you will have us believe don’t kill, yet just listen to the news about Christian massacring Christian once the Muslims had long gone. And the UN sanctioning Special Forces to commit the killings by the supply of sophisticated weapons. So, are you going to blame the Muslims for that?

Islamic TorchYou will find that I am not shy to put hand to pocket and donate to MPAC Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala has praised those who spend their wealth for good causes and at the same time blamed those who are miserly. In the Qur'an Allah has praised the Ansar for the way they gave preference to the Muhajirun (Muslims who migrated from Makkah) over themselves: "But they (Ansar) give them preference over themselves even though they were in need of that (the booty). And whosoever is saved from his own covetousness, such are they who will be the successful." (Al-Hashr, 59:9).


A greedy person also has a weak Iman. He scarcely spends anything for the sake of Allah even if he is called to donate in charity when his Muslim brothers are hungry and afflicted by hardships. There is nothing clearer in this matter than the Book of Allah: "Behold! It is you who are called to spend freely in Allah's Cause: but even among you are such as turn out to be niggardly! And yet, he who acts niggardly in Allah's Cause is but niggardly towards himself: for Allah is Rich, and you are poor. And if you turn away from Him, He will cause other people to take your place, and they will not be the likes of you." (Muhammad, 47:38)

Baz solidarity with Rob

MPAC start a campaign against MONARCH

The people have spoken, well, I and wendy mann

With the greatest ammount of respect to AL and Adrian, the UK is not secular , it is a liberal christian democracy! I appreciate that you may be agnostic , fair enough but our law and traditions are christian.

Islamic torch, you ask the question , why people get hot and bothered about home issues. The simple reason is that this is a UK site and people who comment are from the UK. There is a tremendous risk that relations between the Non-muslim comunity and the muslim comminity could break down to a point where we have a real risk of riots , civil unrest etc, which I'm sure you do not want to see. This has been caused by idiots on both sides, the press for example seem to be getting more and more anti-islamic, often twisting what representatives from your community have said. However on the muslim side lunatics like Anjim Choudary and his mates go answered from more sensible members of your community.

As to Israel, I think you'll find alot of us have commented, and in my case not particually positive about the IDF's strategy of killing everyone in site.

However , why do we never see any articles here for discussion and comment where muslims are comiting outrages e.g. Dharfur, the sunni vs shia war in Iraq (I know the allies made the conditions where it was possible but since then they have been buthering each other)??

Basil,

I hope you don't think me rude. I did pen a long reply to your three questions, but for some reason they havn't yet been published.

Perhaps this page hasn't been updated recently.