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| The New Reality |
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| Wednesday, 26 April 2006 | |
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No recognition of Israel, no negotiations, no laying down of arms. The message from the Tehran conference could not have been clearer. Since the beginning of April Israeli troops have killed more than 30 Palestinians, six of them children. The scale of the Israeli slaughter is three times the toll exacted by last week's Islamic Jihad bombing of a restaurant in Tel Aviv. That's not to seek a moral justification for the killing of civilians in some league table of suffering.
Rather it is to highlight the double standard in international calls for the new Hamas-led government to renounce violence while Israel continues its killings. Viewed against this backdrop, history will no doubt record the EU's attempt to blackmail Hamas as a missed opportunity, and another stride towards the brewing clash of civilisations. No recognition of Israel, no return to negotiations with Israel under the current status quo, and no laying down of arms. They were the words of Ahmed Bahar, the deputy speaker of the Palestinian parliament in a presentation which even stirred the normally timid delegates from Qatar into vigorous applause. And there was little love lost for Europe. Hamas' political bureau chief Khalid Meshal saw the EU's suspension of aid to the new Palestinian government as evidence that the "West wants to crush the will of the Palestinian people". "Islamic nations know their responsibilities", he told the conference in a thinly-veiled appeal for funds that was met with a US$50 million pledge by Tehran, and followed by a similar announcement from Doha. Next to Mishal sat Ramadan Shalla, the leader of Palestine's other Islamic movement, Islamic Jihad. He was no less equivocal. "Even if we are taken to the altar and beheaded we cannot recognise these people (the Zionists)". And his reasoning? "Recognising Israel means the victim giving in to the aggressor and usurper and saying that Palestine is not our land, it is not an Arab or Islamic country." The sentiments were by no means confined to the radicals. The speaker of the Malaysian senate, Abdul Hamid Pawanteh, saw the western reaction to Hamas' win as a gauntlet to the Muslim world and called on it to "recognise and support the elected Palestinian government. Judging from the tone of the conference, patience for western policy towards Palestine is wearing thin in the Muslim world. Since the Oslo Accords were signed in 1993, the main issues at the heart of the Palestine conflict - refugees, Jerusalem, borders and settlements - have remained in diplomatic deep-freeze. However, the Israeli bulldozers and builders have been somewhat more active, enhancing Israel's position on all these issues to the point that its acting premier can talk about unilateral decisions. More fundamentally, Israel has demonstrated that it can count on active western backing and acquiescence in its campaign. But that is forgetting a new reality. Hamas' ascendancy has changed the rules of the game. Its position, which is that justice requires the reversing of Israeli gains, is in tune with the prevailing global Muslim opinion. Hamas, and Tehran for that matter, will not recognise Israel because they believe that to do so would be to relinquish the right of return of five million Palestinian refugees (this non-recognition is not the same as violent destruction of Israel, nor does it equate to any mass ethnic cleansing of Jews). If that seems like a hard-line position, it is no more hard-line than Israel's rejection of the right of return, or its unilateral claim to Jerusalem as its eternal capital. Being in Tehran confirmed the huge gulf between the west's attitude to conflict resolution, which is based on recognising the fruits of Israeli aggression, and the Arab/Muslim stance, spelt out in the conference's final declaration, which is to deny all legitimacy to the "Zionist regime" as a usurper on the soil of Palestine. Some will condemn this return to the bottom line of justice as naive idealism. They will say that circumstances demand an imperfect peace over an unachievable justice. Some of them are genuine but they sit uneasily alongside others who use the argument as a fig leaf for Israeli injustices. They are the ones who dismiss as unrealistic any attempt to roll back Israel's illegitimate gains, whilst simultaneously celebrating the realisation of the Jews' dream of returning to the "promised land" after winding back a 2000-year exile. Europe has now located itself squarely in the Zionist camp. In accepting that Israel cannot be pressured into a just settlement it has rejected the chance to explore new points of departure for a Palestinian-Israeli dialogue. Its failure to recognise the new rules of the game can only hinder the quest for peace and drive the world closer to a clash of civilisations pitting Muslims against the west.
By Faisal Bodi
          Readers have left 25 comments.
S. Benari:
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This article contains all the partiality that the Zionists are criticised for. Yes, Palestinians have been killed recently, the majority have been individuals actively engaged in military action against Israel. The latest suicide bomb was indiscrimate and it's victims victims of chance and opprtunity, there being attempt to target combatants.
Since the unliateral withdrawl from Gaza, Palestinian groups have regularly, almost daily, fired rockets across the border into Israel. As the Hamas gov't is most powerful in Gaza one must assume that this occurs with their sanction. Thus these attacks constitute acts of war against Israel. In that case the Israelis have an entirely legal right to retalitate. If we are at war with Israel, and it appears from the many statements made that we are, then we are hardly in a position to complain about civilian casualties. If we seek the destruction of Israel, then we cannot complain if the Israelis seek the destruction of Palestine. Europe is not squarely in the Zionist camp, it is dismayed that the Palestinians should elect a violently sectarian party into power that is opposed to any lasting peace with Israel. remeber that much of what Hamas publishes and distributes is illegal in Europe under the laws that are designed protect the majority of Muslims and thnic minorities. Further the author omits to mention that accord to the Palestinian Human Rights Centre more Palestinians have been killed by Palestinians in the same period. It is time to get our house in order!
(1)
2006-04-28 08:32:28
jay:
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Only one thing has changed since the 1967 Khartoum "Three Nos"conference - now it is the Muslim world which has rejected peace through negotiations. Essentially, "Plus ca change, plus c'est la meme chose".
Israel cannot and the West should not recognise the fruit of Arab conquest and imperialism, carried out agians tyhe wishes of the original inhabitants of Jewish and Byzantine Palestine. The calendar is thus being set for Huntington's prophecy to reach its conclusion.
(2)
2006-04-28 10:24:33
Mrs Kudarat Khan:
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Very good. The idea that the Palestinians should relinquish arms when the Zionists are murdering them...what the hell do they take the Muslims for?!
(3)
2006-04-28 10:25:24
Sonia:
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So when will the extermination begin? A vast majority of Palestinian Arabs want Israel destroyed. A majority of Muslims worldwide would like Israel destroyed. At least half of Europe sees tiny israel as a giant pain in the tuches (gluteus maximus), and the greatest danger to world peace along with America.
Under all these conditions, how does a victorious nation dare to unilaterally withdraw from territory it won in a war designed to eradicate it? After Oslo backfired so severely, how can supposedly intelligent (sic) Jews, trust these very same people to let them live in peace? You can take this prediction to the Bank (the West Bank (sic)), that rockets will be fired and terrorism will begin once again in earnest. Asking Palestinian Arabs to make peace with Jews is like asking the lion to lie down with the lamb. Only when the Messiah comes! Every time a Palestinian Jew is murdered, the Palestinian Arabs will continue to explain that the terrorism is merely an isolated incident of someone trying to destroy the peace process. All the while, nothing is actually done by the PA to stop the jihadist groups. Yet Israel must continue to give back all the land including Jerusalem, along with "the right of return" to the days when they could attack Jews living nearby. Of course, Europe and the UN would constantly rail that the last 100 or so terrorist attacks were merely isolated incidents, forgetting that the first gas chamber was also an isolated incident. Genocide always begins with one death. As the terrorism dramatically increases from Gaza and the West Bank, the Palestinian Authority will vehemently announce another fraudulent "crackdown," although Israeli withdrawals must continue. To use a modern economic analogy, these events are all about a Bank acquisition gone bad. Israel acquired the (West) Bank through legal defensive action in 1967, first warning its major shareholder, Jordan, that they were about to lose their entire investment. The CEO of Jordan, one King Hussein did not believe these Junk Bond Jews could possibly defeat all of the experienced world class traders of Egypt, Syria, Lebanon, Iraq, Iran who promised their transactional support. The vast Arab/Muslim portfolios were seemingly too powerful for a tiny group of Middle East Jews to contend with in an apparent takeover battle. So these bitter rivals engaged in a proxy war resulting in a clever maneuver by Broker/Dealer Arik Sharon who wrested control of both Sinai and West Bank stock through a very unfriendly takeover situation. Sharon also managed to capture great armies of disenfranchised shareholders in the Egyptian desert as they begged for mercy with actual tears. Presently, the poor losing shareholders want control of the (West) Bank returned to them, along with a few other little things like the most valuable piece of real estate--Old Jerusalem. When will Arab greed end? Imagine making a bad judgment in investing and then wanting it all back...and more! Is that nerve or what! The people who say it is Israeli settlements that have caused the Palestinian/ Arab/Muslim world to blow up Jewish families in pizza parlors and wish to wipe Israel off the map have forgotten one small, simple fact. Was there peace with Israel pre-1967, when Arab countries owned all of the land which they presently want back? Of course not. In fact, that was the time of greatest tension between Israel and its neighbors.
(4)
2006-04-28 15:17:52
George Carty:
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Jay: Israel cannot and the West should not recognise the fruit of Arab conquest and imperialism, carried out agians the wishes of the original inhabitants of Jewish and Byzantine Palestine.
Where did you learn your history? I thought that most of the inhabitants of Palestine at the time of the Islamic conquests were Monophysite Christians, and welcomed the Arabs as liberators from Byzantine persecution (the former Greek population of Byzantine Palestine would probably have resisted the Arabs, had they not already been massacred by the Persians - the Persian paid the price when the Muslims conquered them). Why were there no anti-Arab rebellions in newly-occupied Palestine? Jay: The calendar is thus being set for Huntington's prophecy to reach its conclusion. How exactly do you plan to fight an ideology as tenacious as Islam? The French ruled Algeria for 130 years, but its population (other than the French settlers of course) remained as strongly Islamic as it was before the French conquest. Even the totalitarian atheist Soviet Union didn't manage to kill Islam in the parts of Central Asia it occupied. And the Spanish Inquisition tried to forcibly convert Spanish Muslims to Christianity, only for to fail miserably, inducing the Spanish state to resort to outright ethnic cleansing to solve its "Muslim problem" (they had more success with the Jews, though). Muslims may have profound differences with the West, but IMHO they are not so horrifically evil that their genocide would be justifiable.
(5)
2006-04-28 15:37:09
Bilal Patel:
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Yes Ben Ari, the world should recognise that there is a war with Israel and under the circumstances, should choose not to moralise about resistance attacks which kill Jews any more than Jewish attacks which kill non-Jews. And since there is a war, the West can either choose to get involved and make itself a target of attacks in the West (eg 9/11 and 7/7)and an undending war of attrition or else it can disengage and let the American colony currently occupying Palestine sort it's own mess out. Under the circumstances therefore, there should be absolutely no compulsion for Hamas to recognise 'Israel'.
(6)
2006-04-28 17:47:30
Andrew:
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The world will NEVER recognise israel, it is a fanatical terrorist Anti Semitic settlement that exists to exterminate all of Humanity. These "fruits" are a poison apple to decency & equality, there NEVER was an "ancient israel". It wants to expand until the whole world is israel & considering its non origin & fallacy of "peace" is plain to see for the real free world. Real Jews know there never was a Jewish homeland & the continuous lying & murder of the Semites by mass genocidal settlers will only result in the world retaliating against this parasite.
(7)
2006-04-28 17:56:05
S. Benari:
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Dear Mrs Khan
It is a sad fact that since the mid 1920's the Palestinian armed forces have been more adept at using weapons against other Palestinians and Arabs than they have against the Zionist enemy. Perhaps it is time to think of another strategy. The armed forces are expensive to maintain and totally unproductive, and when the people are starving, it is perhaps time to stop wasting expensive bullets and start buying flour. Remember that a couple of AK47 bullets costs more than a bag of flour in your corner shop.
(8)
2006-04-28 20:48:29
jay:
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No, George Carty: the majority population of the Gallilee at the time of the Muslim Arab invasion in the 7th century were in fact Jews. Jewish farmers at that.
Who is talking about "genocide"? Isn't it simply about time that Islam gave up its idea of world conquest? If you push long enough and hard enough against someone there is no guarantee that they will give in. Indeed, there might be a violent reaction. Some kind of reaction is already happening on the European continent where many political candidates, parties and states are beginning to re-think their whole approach to immigration and Muslim immigration in particular. Not a moment too soon, indeed.
(9)
2006-04-28 22:50:06
Former Jiahdist:
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Very good article indeed.
What is left for the Jihadists worldwide to do, with the plenty of spare time they have now, is to slit each other's throat.
(10)
2006-04-29 00:42:52
sharif:
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Muslims have only themselve to blame despite having the oportunity to rule the world they chose to be ruled,
when america drop bombs from a fighter plane in iraq to kill muslims they call it war on terror, but on the ground when the iraqi's defending themselves it's call terrorism. when israeli's fireign at palestanian from helicopter they call it retaliation, but when palestanian return fire? yes its call terrorism. its about time for the muslims to wake up and traine the palestanian as fighter pilots so they can drop a bomb to retaliate against the KAFIR'S.
(11)
2006-04-29 13:25:29
jay:
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So much for a display of muslim "tolerance" by SHARIF. Kafir's, indeed! We see the world of Islam writ large here. Ironic that this word entered Boer vocabulary in apartheid South Africa via Swahili from Arabic.
(12)
2006-04-30 11:54:55
Mike:
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What a joke! The EU owes nothing to the Palestinians. Financial aid is a privilege not a right, how dare Hamas treat it as such.
(13)
2006-04-30 20:15:47
An European:
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The West owes israel absolutely NOTHING, why should we have to pay for its parasitical "existence". It uses blackmail to steal money & resources & shows how "tolerant" it is by racially abusing the Whites. We see the world of zionist jews here, defending child rape, allowing the tidal wave of Apartheid filth to come here. Such admission of the boer ideology (Apartheid) with its yiddish & ivrit origins is a good start.
(14)
2006-05-01 09:14:28
Sonia:
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''Hamas should be allowed to run in the upcoming Palestinian Arab elections.''
True, Hamas rejects Israel's very right to exist--no matter what its size--so this goes against even what the phony Oslo peace process calls for. And while Hamas' own patron saint, Sheikh Izzedin al-Qassam (for whom the brigade which blows up buses and restaurants is named for, along with the rockets aimed at Jews as well), was a native of Latakia, Syria along with scores of thousands of other allegedly "native Palestinians" (along with most others who flocked into the Mandate in the late 19th and early 20th centuries from other "Arab" lands according to the Records of the League of Nations Permanent Mandates Commissions and other solid documentation), Hamas rejects the rights of Jews to any part of the Dar ul-Islam. Keep in mind that half of Israel's Jews were refugees from so-called "Arab" and/or Muslim lands. Nevertheless, as long as Israel follows through with what needs to be done, Hamas' candidates should be on the slate. What sense is there to keep playing the same old game? The Arafatians now in power have made clear over and over that they differ with Hamas only in tactics. As I've often stated before, blown buses bring bad press. The end goal--Israel's destruction--is the same for both, as a quick view of the Palestinian Authority's own statements, websites, textbooks, media, maps, and such illustrates. Abbas' own military folks have repeatedly stated that Israel will be the sole target of their arms. Recall that Condi was in Israel not long ago demanding that the Jews themselves supply the PA with those arms. Poll after poll taken among Palestinian Arabs show that even if Israel returned to its 1949 nine-mile wide, armistice line-imposed, rump state status, most Arabs would still support terrorism and reject its right to exist. So folks...there's no nice way of putting this. Israel faces deadly, rejectionist enemies and must deal forcefully with this unfortunate reality sooner rather than later. Give it credit...Unlike the let's-destroy-Israel-but-by-other-more-acceptable-means Arafatians, at least Hamas is up front and honest on these issues. So there's no doubt as to how Hamas must be handled. No Israeli concessions short of national suicide will suffice for it. And that's why Hamas needs to be a choice for Arab voters the next time around. The Arab Street needs to make a collective decision--so Hamas itself cannot alone be blamed--for the policies that will then be carried out in its name. If Hamas wins, the Arab voters will have told the entire world that they reject the alleged "two-state" solution that others--including the American State Department and such--falsely claim that they accept. The reality, of course, is that even the alleged PA "moderates," such as Abbas and Qurei, openly reject the right of a Jewish Israel to exist, speak only in terms of a hudna (ceasefire--not permanent peace), and have called all such dealings with the Jews merely a Trojan Horse designed to bring about the Arabs' ultimate goal. And for this the Jews are expected to give away the store. When the predictable next atrocity against Jewish innocents is then carried out (notice how Kofi Anan & Co. cry out profusely about innocent Arabs killed at a wedding in Jordan but typically make excuses when Jews are the targets, killed at Passover Seders, weddings, and the like), terror will have a democratically-decided address. Nations have gone to war for far less than seeing their own people repeatedly butchered. So, Israel must make very clear--and not just by blowing hot air--that it will consider any terror subsequent to the Palestinian elections an act of war. After the elections, if the new Arab government shows--unlike the current one, which still allows terror to continue--that it is truly willing to fight the sources of terror and enemies of permanent peaceful coexistence with a Jewish State (again, no hudna manure...please), then Israel should allow for a grace period and offer assistance. If, however, as will most likely be the case, the new, democratically-elected government opts to just play more good cop/bad cop games with Israel, the Jews need to finally wise up and do what must be done: Unleash pure hell on the murderers of Jewish innocents. Israel must first issue an ultimatum to the new Arab government. When that ultimatum is predictably next ignored, it must declare war, fight to win, and tell the hypocrites in the United Nations and elsewhere to ask themselves what they would be doing if they were in Israel's shoes. And the Arabs will have brought this all upon themselves by democratically electing a government which openly calls for the destruction of both Jews as a nation and as a people. One more time... What other nation would have put up with this reality as long as Israel already has?
(15)
2006-05-02 12:14:30
kal:
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Interesting if sometimes rabid debate.
For those keen on historical context, there's an excellent book 'Bad news from Israel' that contains an excellent synopsis. The reality is that the Palestinians are an invaded and dispossessed indiginous people. It is the right of all oppressed and occupied people to determine the means of their resistance. Nazi germany was famously resisted by the French and patriotic partisans across Europe. The so called 'legal' creation of Israel was a lie. The US bullied weaker UN members to vote with it. It was monstrous injustice to allocate a country of 1.5M inhabitants to a pre invasion jewish minority of 150000. Obscene. This does have some things in common with the US but none of them good. It has nothing to do with the virtues of freedom, endeavour, democracy. It has everything to do with the disenfranchisement, genocide and opression of the native americans. This was a display of POWER, US power. It was cruelly exercised on a population that was unable to defend themselves, palestinian peasants. Subsequently, all international legal norms were trashed by annexation of conquered territory and refusing refugees the right of return. Instead, brutalised jewish refugees from Europe's tribal killing fields were shipped into palestine rather than allowing them the right to return to THEIR homelands, or to other destinations in Europe and the US. These desperate people were cynically used as the shock troops for Zionist dispossession of palestinian peasants. And so it has continued. There never was a 'tiny Israel'. This is the 4th largest nuclear power. A state in continual and aggressive expansion, attacking its neigbours and disenfranchising indiginous people. It is based on a racist concept of Jewish supremacy, a racially pure jewish state, or the devine right given by a curiously interpreted religious myth. How can it do that? It was created by US power and is guaranteed by US power; kept alive by US taxpayers dollars, while New Orleans rots.
(16)
2006-05-02 15:01:41
S. Benari:
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Kal, you display a curiously distorted perspective of history. The Zionists were never invaders in the sense of an army storming up the beaches. Prior to 1948 they obtained land by purchasing it from the Palestinian owners. How so much land became amassed into so few Palestinian hands is a complex issue. However Zionist land purchases provided generous replacement for the loss of bribes and commissions obtained by tax-farming for this elite. Certainly the Zionists sought to establish a homeland / state for themselves, and other Jews. But the Palestinian leadership also proposed to drive the Jews into the sea, and grab back the land they had sold them.
In truth it is hard to assert that either one has moral superiority over the other. The only thing that can perhaps be said it that the ordinary Palestinian peasants were the overall losers. The Zionists did not prevent Jews from returning to their homes after June 1945. What caused their sudden rush to Palestine was the outbreak of violence against them in places such as Kielce. But these refugees did not play a major role in the 1948 battles, and as at Latrun proved to be a liability. More important was the USSR's willingness to allow experienced soldiers to leave and go to Palestine. But still most of the real fighting was done by people born in Palestine, not recent immigrants. The USSR was active in recognising Israel and facilitated weapons sales via Czechoslovakia. Yes, it may seem unfair that the Palestinians have been displaced by the Zionists, but on balance it is not much different from many similar incidents. It's importance in the Arab world is due to the shock that successive Israeli successes caused, and how much that threatens Arab / Muslim self-perception. For a dominant group that sees itself in terms of being warriors, it was a cataclysmic disaster to be beaten in war by the despised Jews, whom are in popular perception weak and cowardly.
(17)
2006-05-02 19:34:01
Mike:
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The best solution:
1. the rest of the world works together to create/discover an alternative to middle-eatern oil 2. Israel & the Arab middle-east annihilate each other 3. the rest of the world destroys what is left of that disease called organised religion & lives happily ever after, eternally grateful that the two biggest pains-in-the-arse on the planet are gone
(18)
2006-05-02 19:38:46
Neutral and Objective Judge of D:
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Contest results:
A++ goes to Zionists presenting only facts, tolerance and peace loving by a people that is 1% the size of the despicable "Ummah", yet have more than 20% of the world's Nobel Prize winners. This they do inspite of being persecuted, executed, exterminated, hated for no fault on their part. FFF---- goes to Jihadists on this website who fantasize, lie, cheat, deceive, steal, behead humans and than claim to be innocent, while they have all the necessary resources to excel they do not take advantage of any of this.
(19)
2006-05-02 22:10:50
steve:
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This debate has such liars replying to it, the neutral & balanced person can only say that israel has nothing to do with the self propagated suicide 60 years ago. sharon ran away to W Russia, as the coward settlements version of history is as accurate a the nazi (zionist) scum!! The West even has to re-badge these fanatics stolen produce including coming to fight for it at every point. A F grade for israel since it cannot function without the £billions it gets “given” (through blackmail), remember “homes for votes”? The money is in israel, so why did Europe accept to fight against an “invasion” by the nazis, because it is its right to remove mass murdering fanatics just like the Palestinians do. The acceptance of israel is worse then accepting the nazi / fascists.
(20)
2006-05-03 10:31:06
kal:
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Congrats S. Benari, at least there is an attempt to engage.
In your response you fall into the trap of 3 more myths; 1. The palestinians sold out 2. The fighting was done by palestinian (indiginous) jews. 3. This is a cataclysmic battle between judaism and islam. 1. The palestinian peasants did not sell out enmasse. During the corrupt end of the Ottoman empire, absentee landlords with dodgy deeds were lobbied by rich European zionists at the Ottoman court. In many cases money was handed over to people who had never even been to palestine and subsequently interpreted as legal title by the British mandate. Subsequently a quite deliberate and documented policy of expansion by ethnic cleasing was adopted by the Zionists. They were armed to the teeth with modern weaponry and British mandate troops prevented even ammunition reaching palestinian peasants. Flintlocks versus machine guns. Specific villages were targetted by the Zionists for atrocities to then terrorise entire unarmed peasant populations into fleeing. It was very similar to the ethnic cleansing carried out by the Serbs where UN troops prevented arms reaching Bosnians. The ethnic cleansing was a deliberate strategy not incidental. this is well documented including by israeli historians. 2. The fighting was done by palestinian jews. The Zionists began moving into the area by the early 1900s. They had only one intention, to drive out the indiginous people. It matters not that some of those fighting in 1945 were the indoctrinated children of these people. Their numbers were still a fraction of the indiginous population in 1945. Ordinary Europeans who happened to be jewish were not keen on going to palestine. The WW2 refugees were cynically starved and then transported to palestine when for many, the first choice was to return home or go to another European or a US destination. This was a cynical manipulation of the refugees' desperation by the Zionists. . .again, well documented. Work it out for yourself! Why would a traumatised European refugee want to go and kill some middle eastern peasant? 3. There is no cataclysmic battle between religions. This is not an 'old enmity'. The muslim Baghdad and Ottoman empires were THE superpower for over 1000 years. Ample time to conceive and execute a genocide (the Serbs only needed 2 years, the Europeans in the Americas and Australia only needed 200 years, the Nazis conceived their nightmare in 20 years). If there was such a concept in Islam, it would have been done. Instead, the Muslim superpowers provided protection for the jews from christian pograms. No half baked, ot of context quotes will change this 1000 year reality. The reality is Benari, that Zionist idealogy is the brainchild of some twisted European empire builders. It is fundamentally racist and supremacist in nature as it subordinates the rights of the indiginous people. It has inflicted huge misery on countless impoverished peasants. It is a cowardly idealogy that uses its members wealth and power to attack those too weak to defend themselves. It encourages participation in slow genocide by using US tax dollars to subsidise the housing, livelihood and lives of those who will take sabbaticals from their own homes in Europe and the US to perpuate the misery of the palestinians. Zionism tries to masquarade as a judaism . . . it is not. There is no space for such an aberration in the modern world. Apardheid was trashed, Zionism will be also. Ask Nelson Mandela, ask Ronnie Kasrils.
(21)
2006-05-03 15:56:34
S. Benari:
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Kal,
I am afraid you are the one who has fallen into the trap of myths. 1st of all who is or isn't a Palestinian? Anyone born there is enough for me. The PLO state that any non-Jew born there, or Jew prior to 1917. The local Jews fought. The issue of land sales is complex due to the nature of leasing under the Ottomans. The leading clans ammassed vast land banks during the late 19th C and then sold them to Zionists. he Mufti referred to absentee landlords to the Peel Commission but there is little evidence to suggest that they were absent in truth - it was a convenience. It is true that at the immediate end of WW2 most Jews in the camps wanted to go home. But the violence they faced forced them back to the camps. I would suggest that Zionism is not about Imperialism but a rational response to the rise of the nation state. Zionism is sectarian not racist, sim[ply because Jews are not a race. But it is no more sectarian and oppressive than the manner in which Sharia is & has been applied to non-Muslims. Muslims need to be very careful when discussing the relationship between Muslims and Dhimmis. As in the Southern States, we would not give credibility to whites's opinion of the black experience. And so Muslim opinions about the experience of the Dhimmis have only limited value. Only the Dhimmis can say what it was like to be Dhimmi under Muslim rule. Remember some white S. Africans genuinely believed that they were acting in the best interests of non-whites!
(22)
2006-05-09 20:25:15
andrea bloch:
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There were no “absentee landlords” as the Palestinians who were ethnically cleansed out of their country only to be replaced by mass murderers. It is such a convenience to repeat this & other lies to cover what are basically the nazis copied. Invading with a powerful puppet cannot by any rational means by a “nation building” exercise, the same things were said by the Apartheid filth “we were there first” & “the land was empty & we made it bloom”. Also non zionists have to use different roads, number plate colours, not allowed to be educated, etc – all active racism.
(23)
2006-05-11 10:27:24
S. Benari:
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Dear Miss Bloch,
I think you should refer to statemenst made by Hajj Amin El-Husseini Mufti of Jerusalem, and leader of the Palestinians, to the Peel Commission regarding land sales by absentee landlords. In fact the Peel Commission doubted his claims, and believed that it was the very present Palestinian feudal landlords that were busily selling land to the Zionists. Re; Number Plates - Vehicles registered in Israel, the West Bank and Gaza have different coloured number plates. This has nothing to do with ethnicity or religion, and everything to do with international law regarding territory occupied during war. It is an offense to allow the integration of occupied territory into the governmental systems of the occupier. Re: Education - Since 1967 all residents of the occupied territories are required by law to attend primary and secodnary school. Prior to '67 no such law existed for girls. (Hence the high level of female illiteracy amongst women in their 50's & 60's) Ostensibly the Israelis reimposed British law regarding education and extended it to include secodnary school. Despite the fascist occupation, several universities have been built in the territories where none existed before. It is my understanding that the changes in education law is a breach of international law, and that the Israelis should have been pulled up over it. Strangely no one chose to do so. You are however correct in claiming that early Zionists made misleading statements about what became Palestine. If I were you I would stick to facts and not silly propaganda, and then you might find you win your arguments.
(24)
2006-05-26 20:14:20
andrea bloch:
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Yes EVERY NGO, actual historian, camera crew is wrong, you are right, the people of Palestine are wrong, EVERYBODY IS WRONG!! Considering Palestine never existed, then came israel this shows what level of delusion you live under.
(25)
2006-05-28 10:38:29
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