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| Who Is Worse, Ed Hussain or Mosque Leaders? |
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| Tuesday, 22 April 2008 | |
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Firstly, neither I nor MPACUK have been in contact with Ed Hussain or the Sufi Muslim Council, and we never have. We cannot answer on their behalf; we can only answer why we are opposed to the so called mega ‘mosque’ being built. But before I move off the subject of the infamous Ed Hussain, I will say something on a point of principle, that no matter how bad Ed Hussain is - or how bad people think he is - he is better than the majority of mosque leaders in Britain. That’s a shocking thing to say perhaps, but it’s a fact, and I’ll elaborate as to why: Ed Hussain didn’t get the Muslims to elect the Vice Chair of the Israel Lobby - the mosque leaders in Ilford did. That same Zionist then went on to push for an attack on Afghanistan through the month of Ramadhan (and we have Muslims claiming that as long as a house of Allah is built it’s a good thing, no matter what murderers run it!) Ed Hussain didn’t get 15,000 Muslims to vote for the man who would ultimately be responsible for pushing a war that would kill a million Muslims – it was the Blackburn mosque leaders that did. Ed Hussain didn’t tell Muslims to vote for the new head of the million pound Israel Lobby – it was the Mosques in Rochdale that did that! Ed Hussain didn’t teach Muslims to hate Muslims. He didn’t make us hate every group with a slight difference of opinion like a bunch of narrow minded racist thugs. Every Muslim hating the other Muslim over minor points of fiqh; Shia hating Sunni, Brelvie hating Wahabi, Wahabi hating Shias, everyone hates everyone - the mosques taught us that. Ed Hussain doesn’t beat Muslims up in the mosque and throw them out for speaking up against a pro Israel MP - the mosques in East Ham did that! Ed Hussain didn’t stop 50% of all Muslims entering the house of Allah – that’s a million people. Those people are our mothers and sisters, and 100% of them will never to be allowed to make any decision within the mosque because they are not allowed to have any position on the committee. No, it was Britain’s mafia of mosque leaders who did that! I’m not defending Ed Hussain, I have no reason to defend him, as I said I have never met him or had any contact with him, and have to be honest never heard anything good said about him. I am not saying he’s a good man, and I am sure there are hundreds of people waiting to tell me how bad he is, all I’m saying is, he doesn’t have blood on his hands, and no matter how bad he may or may not be, he can’t ever be as bad as the mosque leaders in Britain. They’re as good as the cold-blooded murderers they support or refuse to counter. Anyone who takes on Ed Hussain but fails to take on the infinitely worse mosque leaders can't see the wood for the trees! Now, on to the point of why we are not backing the building of the Mega Palace: Simple – how can any Muslim of good conscience back a group who refuse to say they will allow our mothers and sisters onto the committee and give something back to our community, refuse to allow Muslims from London to elect anyone they feel is good enough for the job onto the committee (nepotism), refuse to allow the Muslim public to hold elections (undemocratic), refuse to tell us how black people and white Muslims will be able to get a position onto the committee (racist), and finally refuse to tell us how they will be accountable for their actions to the Muslim and non-Muslim public? Without these basic rights for our community its very foundations are corrupt – what we are getting is Europe’s biggest goon club. We are not getting an open, forward thinking transparent model mosque. What signal are we sending to the other Mosques and the leaders we have, when the most powerful mosque in Europe is allowed to act like a bunch of cave thugs – that is answerable to no one? We will have set back reform a thousand years. If they want to build the biggest mosque in Europe – let it be a model to all mosques - free, open, non sectarian, with all schools of thought allowed to practice and preach. Let young people elect and be part of the committee. Let it be accountable to us, the public. Let it be a beacon of good, allowing young and old free debate, with no violence to those with different opinions. Let women play a part in it, holding positions of authority and contributing back to our children and our society. Let it be the first to teach us how to be citizens of this country, countering terrorism and yet still defend our brothers abroad from bombs and murder by teaching us the power of Democratic involvement – instead of the hypocritical mantra of its current leaders “no politics in the mosque” – while they secretly shake hands with every politician who can give them a grant or allow them some planning permission of kick back. MPACUK wants reform. We want mosques to be a centre of our revival, our protection, our community. We don’t need more empty prayer halls. We don’t need more goon clubs for powerful old men’s egos. We don’t need any of this. We want change. The mosque may go ahead – but any Muslim who backs it – will soon find that the goons they backed who are accountable to no one – will betray the Muslims like they always have. Then those very people who are vocal in supporting it now, will be answerable to the Ummah and to Allah for why they allowed men to control the house of Allah that were not fit to do so. All we want is a guarantee that this mosque - which will be the biggest mosque in Europe - will not be run like most of the mosques in Britain – like a private club for a mafia elite. By Asghar Bukhari Note: Since MPACUK believes in allowing differing opinions on this website, if you are from the mosque or agree with it being built in its current unaccountable state, feel free to send us in your article and we will put it up without censure.           Readers have left 27 comments.
Wayfarer:
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Assalamu alaikum
Whilst I agree with many of the points above, I will disagree with the ideal mosque being one that allows those of all sects to enter. I am not from the Tabligh and I am all for Muslims of all groups (as long as they are Muslims) working together for a common good (e.g. our welfare in the community) but ANY mosque that states that there is no difference between Sunni and Shia, etc. has lost my respect for really following the line of liberal humanism and the whole irrational concept of 'no absolute truth'. There are differences of opinion within Islam but there are clear cut issues and often it is these that different groups will argue about. One should debate these with in an intellectual manner but allow all others to enter their respective mosques and despite these differences should overlook them for the sake of the greater good in some areas. I follow a particular belief and the fact that I disagree with someone and not allow them to preach in my mosque is my right; that doesn't make me a goon, its how I then apply my character with those whom I disagree with
(1)
2008-04-23 05:28:55
Mohammed:
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I don't know if you have read the Islamist, but Ed attacks every muslim group you can think of as well as some very basic principles of islam. He also agreed with the war on Iraq. He is a neocon. Maybe, you should do a little bit more reasearch before you open your mouth.
(2)
2008-04-23 07:00:35
Sonia:
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I don't know if you have read the Islamist, but Ed attacks every muslim group you can think of as well as some very basic principles of islam. He also agreed with the war on Iraq. He is a neocon. Maybe, you should do a little bit more reasearch before you open your mouth. — MohammedThis is not about how good he is, its about how bad they are. How we allowed these people to ever lead us I will never understand. Its time we all start to demand better leaders. As a woman - to be honest i hate th fact i can never be a committee member and take part in my local mosque and give something back to the young people in my community.
(3)
2008-04-23 09:49:15
Haseeb:
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Ed Hussain is certainly a neo-con, a member of the Labour party who supported the war on Iraq and western intervention in Muslim countries, and actively attacks Islamic organisations and indeed core Islamic concepts.He is basically an opportunist who wants credibility and fame for his neo-con activities and is therefore supported by the likes of Melanie Phillips, Michael Gove and other pro-zionist neo-cons.
Yes there are serious problems in our mosque leadership and in youth/women participation, but MPAC should not allow itself to be aligned , even inadvertantly, with anti-Islamic organisations especially in the case of the mega-mosque. The building of the mega-mosque is not the problem, indeed it could become a vehicle for Dawah in London, and as such it should be supported. If there are issues with regards to how it will function that is a separate point which can/should be addressed but to support the 'ban' on its construction simply plays into the hands of the zionist and Islamophobic lobby. MPAC should think before it acts, because political actions and messages can be used by those who actively seek to undermine Islam and Muslims.
(4)
2008-04-23 10:38:48
Melanie:
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Judge a man by the company he keeps: Ed Hussain is surrounded more by non-Muslims than by Muslims. Why? The answer may be staring us in the face.
As for the mosque 'leaders': they are usually well-meaning village idiots (sometimes they are evil village idiots). They are more concerned about throwing their weight about (and some of them do weigh an awful lot, goodness me!) and exerting power than piety, calling everybody in sight 'brother' when their is nothing brotherly about their intentions. The big tent (sorry, 'Mosque') is just going to house a circus of egos. If it is allowed, then it should be a women-only Mosque. No more bearded buffoons leading the Ummah. Time for women to lead and command.
(5)
2008-04-23 11:14:14
shan:
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Ed Hussain by his lies and deceit will effect the thinking of millions of fellow british citizens.
ed hussain is a nobody,he was not elected by muslims to represent them,he was a selfish egotistical person when he joined the group and now he is making money from his own ego problems. if anyoen considers people like ed to be representatives of british muslims then they are living in cuckoo land,ed representing mulsims is like paedophile priests representing christians. The masjids are run by old fogies who do not have a strong grasp of what their blind support for labour has done to standing of british muslims in other peoples eyes. The masjids role will become more positive with time as more educated people take over, who use their knowledge to do their bidding not their fists.
(6)
2008-04-23 12:01:10
kermit:
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I was wondering what mpac's argument was going to be...Ed hussain has been a sell-out and self-hater for a long time, and the more he upsets muslims the better he feels.
so it came as a surprise to me that mpac hadn't called him out... however looking at your reasoned argument (you still havent called him out), you make some valid and clear points about perspective. why pick on this numbskull when we have allowed our mosque leaders to do everything he does (supports neo-cons and zionists) for decades. why is he so bad? the answer is simple, he isnt. he is just another piece of floating scum on the cess pool that is the ummah.
(7)
2008-04-23 13:33:42
ali akbar:
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Ed Hussain by his lies and deceit will effect the thinking of millions of fellow british citizens. — shaned hussain is a nobody,he was not elected by muslims to represent them,he was a selfish egotistical person when he joined the group and now he is making money from his own ego problems. if anyoen considers people like ed to be representatives of british muslims then they are living in cuckoo land,ed representing mulsims is like paedophile priests representing christians.
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2008-04-23 13:34:08
Reality:
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The day (22/4/2008) Ed Hussein et al officially launch their anti-Islamic hypocrite sell-out organisation – the Quilliam Foundation - what do we find on MPACUK’s website on the same day:
Article entitled: - “Who Is Worse, Ed Hussain or Mosque Leaders?” Brothers/sisters pls take heed of this important statement: MPAC should think before it acts, because political actions and messages can be used by those who actively seek to undermine Islam and Muslims. And yes indeed MPACUK does think before it acts – don’t u Bukhari boyz?– for u know exactly what u are doing indeed! Assalamu alaikum — WayfarerI will disagree with the ideal mosque being one that allows those of all sects to enter. Absolutely. And the reason for the MPACUK’s (Trojan Horse) proposition for this - is so the Doors of Masjids can be opened and its pulpit controlled by heretic secularist hypocrites in the long term who intend and wish to change the Deen itself. I presume the next thing they will do now is post a few articles against the illegal terrorist Zionist state to whip up emotion, in order to deceive the simpletons and re-enforce their engineered perception of them.
(9)
2008-04-23 17:44:25
Barbarossa:
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Reality has busted MPACUK - top work reality.
the only problem is there are more websites from the Zionists attacking MPAC then any other Muslim group including all the Mosques put together. Is that all a clever plot? I mean MPACUK always talks about zionists, hardly any other Muslim group does, they get attacked by zionists while no other group does ... so the logical answer is ......they must be Zionists! Man your a rocket scientist!
(11)
2008-04-23 19:33:18
Adebayo:
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MPACUK has made some valid points, and an invalid comparison- between some UK Muslim leaders and Ed Hussein. The real issue for me is not who these individuals are, but rather that which is in them that make them do what they do. So for instance, if Ed Hussain has in him the things that make the so-called mosque/Muslim leaders who politically empower pro-Zionist politician, he is just a time bomb waiting to explode. One is not better than the other as long as each has in him the same things. Each will only reveal his true colour when the right colour exist.
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2008-04-23 21:35:07
Osama:
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So you'd only be against Ed Hussain if he ran a mosque?
I can't see any real difference between those you criticise and Ed (he in fact supports the Iraq war rather than just support MPs that backed it), apart from the former at least maintain a place where people can pray.
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2008-04-23 21:56:33
Reality:
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@Barbarossa
I have not accused MPACUK of being Zionists. If you wish to view the entire issue in primitive simplistic terms and ignore the deeper wider issue – the bigger picture and its complex nature – you are more than welcome and I totally understand as - dear brother that is exactly what I expect from simpleton MPACUK followers.
(14)
2008-04-23 22:15:32
Mumbali:
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MPACUK has made some valid points, and an invalid comparison- between some UK Muslim leaders and Ed Hussein. The real issue for me is not who these individuals are, but rather that which is in them that make them do what they do. So for instance, if Ed Hussain has in him the things that make the so-called mosque/Muslim leaders who politically empower pro-Zionist politician, he is just a time bomb waiting to explode. One is not better than the other as long as each has in him the same things. Each will only reveal his true colour when the right colour exist. — AdebayoExcellent point, however the leaders of the Mosques actually have the capability to commit the crimes. Its one thing a common street criminal wanting to commit mass murder and a criminal world leader wanting it. One actually has the ability to do it. Equally the Mosque Leaders are far more of a threat and danger to the Muslim community then Ed Hussain who admittedly is an unsavory character with extreme links to right wing pro Israel groups and individuals. It seems to me, MPAC is making some valid points, but using some unorthadox means to get them across. It will be interesting what other Muslim groups have to say on the matter. So far most are silent on the issue of both Ed Hussain and MPAC's stand on reform of the mega mosque.
(15)
2008-04-23 22:16:57
Barbarossa:
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@Barbarossa — RealityI have not accused MPACUK of being Zionists. If you wish to view the entire issue in primitive simplistic terms and ignore the deeper wider issue – the bigger picture and its complex nature – you are more than welcome and I totally understand as - dear brother that is exactly what I expect from simpleton MPACUK followers. Now your not ranting like a lunatic, perhaps one can make out what you are trying to say. i read your posts on the other thread found myself thinking 'i dont agree with him but i respect his logical thinking, then came onto this thread and realised you were actually back to your lunatic self! If MPAC are not Zionists? Who are they a 'trojan horse for' - the zionists are the biggest most evil threat to the Muslim world, so if they are not one of them then i dont care. As long s MPAC fight zionists thats good enough for me! You seem to think the Mosques are like sacred cows and no one can say a word against them! i find it strange that not a single person who has complained has been able to counter a single thing that the articls have said, they all just upset about every minor point 'you called them thugs awww' - The point that mpac can get away with saying correctly that these villains are worse as or as bad as Ed Hussain and no one counter that with a factual argument should tell us something about the state of leadership we have! No one wants the Government to run the mosques i agree with you, no one wants a secular mosque i agree with you and yes there is an agenda to make this happen i agree with you again ....BUT you miss a point ....most mosques are secular thanks to our leaders, and most are already so in bed with the Government that they cant see the sun anymore they are stuck so far up! So if you are going to be honest! - the trojan horse is the mosque leaders and not the people who expose them! I dont like the fact that Ed Hussain is on the same list as mpac either - doesnt mean mpac are not right about the leaders of the mosque though. Two seperate issues in my mind.
(16)
2008-04-23 22:29:59
sister shamila:
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So you'd only be against Ed Hussain if he ran a mosque? — OsamaI can't see any real difference between those you criticise and Ed (he in fact supports the Iraq war rather than just support MPs that backed it), apart from the former at least maintain a place where people can pray. And as a praciticing Muslim sister - i too am sick of the mosque men who treat us like second class cattle. if a group is finally standing up for us! i say good luck to them and thankyou! Let the Hizb sort out the mess they got into with Ed H - let mpac carry on enjoining the right and forbidding the wrong!
(17)
2008-04-23 23:04:36
Reality:
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@Barbarossa:
Please do not insinuate what I stated or didn’t state. If u have failed to understand my previous posts I can’t articulate what I wish to state better that that. But briefly let me just say: 1. Our enemies are not limited to Zionists 2. Apart from the Zionists – we also face the Secularist threat 3. Secularists are apostates – which mean not Muslims 4. Ed Hussein is a secularist – in fact he is now one of the heads of the callers of secularism targeting the Muslims 5. Look to the title of the thread and read its implications 6. Islam has set principles and beliefs and methods in dealing with issues and people 7. As Muslim we dot ally with any of the enemies of Islam against Muslims 8. TJ are Muslims despite their certain issues – i.e. –pacifism etc. Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyah said: “The obligation of the believers is to choose both his friends and his enemies for the Sake of Allah. Whenever they are believers, he must ally himself with them, even if they have wronged him, since no personal offence can absolve one of the alliance in faith. Allah has said: “And if two parties or groups among the believers fall to fighting, then make peace between them both” (Al-Hujurat 49:9) Allah has made them brothers, despite their fighting and rebellion towards one another, and has commanded his reconciliation. So the believer should reflect upon the fact that he owes loyalty to his brother, even if he has been wronged by him or finds that he is his adversary and that the disbeliever is his enemies, even if he is kindly treated by him and respected. Allah sent His Messengers and Revealed His Books in order that all religion should be devoted to him – Alone; therefore love should be only for those who are loyal to him and anger is for His enemies. Respect and honor are for His friends, while degradation and humiliation are for his foes.” (Majmu’ al-fatawa, Vol 28, pg 208-209) Fort me only those who harbour an agenda to hurt Muslim interest ally with Neo-cons, Racists and apostate secularists against Muslims who wish to build a Masjid Only a shaytan (devil) wishes to stop and ruin the building and establishment of a Masjid. We have many issues and long complex problems. Masjid leaders are negligent and some are simple hypocrites but to slate them all and equate or make them worse than Ed Hussein is basically saying – “Our Masjids are run by apostates” – which is not the case! A Group who’s actions and words which only seem to totally weaken, destroy, discredit, dishonour every grass-root Muslim group, Masjid, Imams, community leaders, & then subsequently the Sunnah, the Islamic rituals, the spiritual and theological aspects & sow the seeds of chaos, distrust and division in a manner that which in consequence ONLY seems to in the long term strengthen the voices of the hypocrites and the secularist apostates is nothing but a “Trojan Horse”. To get the Muslims into the system and at the SAME time erode their values is a plot of the enemies of Islam. Harbouring oneself under the cloak of “champions the cause of Islam” by using the system - lobbying, media activities is superficial and only serves to gain trust, sympathy and influence within the community in order to carry out its agenda. We need a grass-root based group that harbours no agenda that is principle based, understands the dynamics, sensitivities and complexity of the issues of the community & which can provide realistic practical and effective solutions with no strings attached.
(18)
2008-04-24 00:11:23
ali akbar:
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for mempacs points are valid. simple and logical. while ed hussain make it public that he has neo-con friends, the mosques hide the fact. i live in ilford and Mike Gapes is a hardcore zionist. and he meets and is worshipped by all the mosques.
in regards to the quotes by reality, it seems you miss the point. if mpac is argueing with the osque leaders for greater accountability, then surely you should not take sides, you should make peace...but you have clearly taken sides. in regards to a 'trojan horse' who are the trojans? lets see if you can understand any of the wisdom you like to quote. or has it become dogma.
(19)
2008-04-24 08:03:41
Somalian Sister:
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Good points but some things you have missed out or there is a gap in your understanding of the enemy.
Ed hussain is not powerful because he is secular, he is powerful because his backers are Zionists. Go to the website and you will see most of his backers are neo con Zionists including high profile people like Melanie (zionist IDF racist) Philips. The backers in Government from my sources are all pretty much Zionists who are using their positions to push them. so you would be foolish to think they are not root and branch backed by zionists and that Zionists are the number one enemy of Muslims who are out to destroy the Ummah. Clinton recently said if she got into power we would obliterate Iran - do you think thats the 'secularist society???' - no it is AIPAC! - the american israeli publuc affairs committee!!!!!! They may use secularism as a tool to harm Islam but the people behind it are Zionists. Secondly the mosques may not ALL have the heart of Ed Hussain (many hearts are infact are worse) - but as Imam Al Ghazzali said the soul of a man can be judged by his actions. You cannot deny the mosques did back 'knowingly' the man who would kill a million muslims in iraq. Its not like you are saying they were ignorant and poorly informed! they knew full well! Its the same with the other criminal actions of the leaders like backing the israel lobby mp - again they were informed of this - they were not some old poor fuddy duddy who would not have acted like that if they were only told not too! - see operation muslim vote and you can even see there were leaflets with all the information on them!!! So you cant say that these mosque leaders actions are not against the Quran and the Sunnah, that they did not ally themselves with open enemies of Allah, and the result was not the murder of our brethen in Palestine, Afghanistan and Iraq. Jack straw made Hamas a terrorist group - whilst the mosque leaders backed him, he also introduced many of the terror laws that now lock up sisters who write poems on jihad - you seem to think this is some innocent mistake by mosque leaders and we should love them for this! They break the very injunctions of the Quran you state and then you claim we should love them!1 - you should fear Allah when quoting brother for you use Quotes to protect the enemies of Allah and attack those who are his friends! You are acting like a sincere muslim but who is chained by some mistaken love for men who have totally sold the Ummah to the highest bidder - betrayed us, and then claimed they are our leaders. Lastly I am a black sister - for that fact alone these men will never let me into the mosque. You make little of these mens crimes claiming how innocent and mistaken they are - but they are still good. Good my dear brother is in the doing - and they have done nothing but evil.
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2008-04-24 09:47:37
Reality:
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Part 1
1. A secularist does not automatically mean – he/she supports the illegal terrorist Zionist State – there are many secularist apostates in the Arab world but who hate the Zionist state and call for “social justice” nor a secularist automatically means he/she is for western hegemony and domination against Muslims – A secularist is simply a kaafir who separates the Deen from running the affairs of the state – who disbelieves in a part of Qur’aan and believes in another – who denies that Allah Alone is the Legislator and Law Maker – who denies the supremacy of the Shariah and the obligation to rule by it on a state basis. 2. Mahmoud Abbas and his PLO/Fatah movement in Palestine for instance are Secularists! 3. In the global sense - the threat we face is multi-faceted and our enemies are different – The Muslim Ummah faced/faces the communist threat an ideology which is against Capitalism and western imperialism, it faced/faces secularist nationalists which pursue to destroy the Religion but they at the same time were against “Israel” and even fought against them! 4. And it faces Zionism and Neo-con imperialism To simply look at all these threats, issues, and challenges we face and blame them entirely on the Jews (Zionists) that they are behind all of it – will stray the focus and limit ones response which has consequences. One of the aims of the secularist Anti-Islamic Quillium Foundation is to “train and support a new generation of “mainstream” scholars and leaders”– what will MPACUK(Trojan Horse) be proposing next? – in the name of fighting the Zionist threat and due to the failure and negligence of the currant Masjid leaders of being active in fighting them and their other deficiencies and failures - will they be embracing this Quillium Foundation project? –“Ed Hussein at the end of the day is better than ALL Masjid leaders – right?” - With rhetoric that it will produce Imams who will allow Muslim women in Masjids, be accountable and democratic, use the system efficiently to make known our grievances and fix social issues – sounds great hey? And that’s exactly what I mean and u will indeed get the above but at the cost of the Deen of the next generation and will witness its ramification effect in the years to come……… The secularist threat is a threat to our Islam in terms of aqeedah (beliefs) - It is no point of fighting Zionism, fight for Palestinian rights, fight for “social justice”, open Masjids that cater for the sisters etc if ur going to die upon secularism and burn in Hell for eternity – that’s the point.
(21)
2008-04-24 15:47:24
Reality:
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Part 2
And let me stress again –those 3 or 4 examples from the article of masjid individuals who allied with Zionism IS blameworthy and IS hypocrisy! But how does that justify this???: Alan Craig, Irfan al-Alawi,>>Asghar and Zulfiqar Bukhari of the Muslim Public Affairs Committee <<<, Dr Taj Hargey, Haras Rafiq of the Sufi Muslim Council, Ed Husain,, BNP, Islamophobes and racists - Against Muslims in building and establishing a >Masjid<!!!! So its hypocrisy and some further hypocrisy!!! Supporting the building of a Masjid – A House of Allah - does it mean one loves the committees or their policies, in fact even TJ – no! Not following the hypocrisy of MPACUK (Trojan Horse) on this - does it mean one loves the Masjid leaders especially the hypocrites such as Ibrahim Master– Absolutely Not! As for the issue of these current Masjids not catering for the sisters – go around the Muslim world and ask yourselves how many Masjids cater for the sisters!! – that’s the point - This is a long standing issue for probably hundreds of years due to ignorance & decadence and in many cases due to impracticalities in establishing the facilities! – And can only be changed through education and patience – not by allying with neo-cons, Racists and hypocrites or following a deliberate strategy to empower the hypocrites and secularist apostates in the long term under the banner of “women rights” – btw – “women rights” is another flash ambiguous slogan the kuffar use to invade Muslim lands and kill Muslims.
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2008-04-24 15:47:45
Haseeb:
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Part 2 — RealityAnd let me stress again –those 3 or 4 examples from the article of masjid individuals who allied with Zionism IS blameworthy and IS hypocrisy! But how does that justify this???: Alan Craig, Irfan al-Alawi,>>Asghar and Zulfiqar Bukhari of the Muslim Public Affairs Committee <<<, Dr Taj Hargey, Haras Rafiq of the Sufi Muslim Council, Ed Husain,, BNP, Islamophobes and racists - Against Muslims in building and establishing a >Masjid<!!!! So its hypocrisy and some further hypocrisy!!! Supporting the building of a Masjid – A House of Allah - does it mean one loves the committees or their policies, in fact even TJ – no! Not following the hypocrisy of MPACUK (Trojan Horse) on this - does it mean one loves the Masjid leaders especially the hypocrites such as Ibrahim Master– Absolutely Not! As for the issue of these current Masjids not catering for the sisters – go around the Muslim world and ask yourselves how many Masjids cater for the sisters!! – that’s the point - This is a long standing issue for probably hundreds of years due to ignorance & decadence and in many cases due to impracticalities in establishing the facilities! – And can only be changed through education and patience – not by allying with neo-cons, Racists and hypocrites or following a deliberate strategy to empower the hypocrites and secularist apostates in the long term under the banner of “women rights” – btw – “women rights” is another flash ambiguous slogan the kuffar use to invade Muslim lands and kill Muslims. Very pertinent points, I dont think MPAC truly understands the bigger picture here.Fine, you can criticise mosque leaders for their faults, and there are many, but to be part of a campaign to prevent the building of a masjid is misguided. MPAC need to understand that Zionism is not the only issue that confronts the Muslims both here and in the wider Muslim world, the attempt to secularise and deconstruct Islamic concepts and beliefs is all part of governments policy to create a sanitised state sponsored Islam that will remain quiet in the face of foreign policy aggression. I agree that the acquiesence of some of our mosque commitees in the governments policies is deplorable, but the way to tackle it is to initiate a discourse within the Muslim community, not grandstanding in a way that is easily exploited by the enemies of Islam and Muslims.
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2008-04-24 16:43:49
Muhammad Foster:
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Reality, your grasp of Zionism and your solution are both poor.
Zionism is far greater danger then any so called secular lobby. Zionism is the number one most organised force in the world today. If you someone are getting all hot and bothered about so called secular lobby then you are simply not competent to defend the Ummah. Virtually all recent attacks on the Muslim world and the occupation of them is because Zionists have or are pushing it. Secular tyrants are an issue no doubt, but again they pale into insignificance compared to the might and organised danger of the Zionists. Even Quillium has the hidden hand of Zionism behind it. I advise you to brush up on your understanding of this threat. It is behind the great clash of civilizations and will no doubt be the reason why east and west goes to war. As for how you deal so calmly and forgivingly about the conduct of mosque leaders. This is against Islam. When a Muslim openly backs the enemies of Allah knowingly that the person will seek to kill and harm the Ummah that person falls out of the fold of Islam. When mosque leaders backed straw and other Zionist members knowing full well that Muslims and Islam would be harmed and even killed by these people they acted like hypocrites mentioned clearly in the Koran. And your solution to these men in your own words 'this can only be changed through education and patience' Would you say this if it was your brother who was living in Iran or Iraq at the time? Nay you have been duped! You fight for culture then not Islam. I do not consider you insincere but acting on some misguided loyalty to those who openly betray the Ummah. The Mosque is bricks and mortar, if that house of Allah is used to murder people then the mosque is no longer serving the purpose Allah chose for it, it must be cleansed as a fard - much like Mecca. Look at Isa PBUH who overturned the tables of the money lenders when they polluted the mosque - but you would allow this evil in the hope that one day it will change by itself - but if a figure comes and turns over the table - you claim they are committing an evil - like the rabbi's of old said about Isa PBUH!!! Nay brother if you have sincerity - you would be as harsh on both evil doers - the likes of Ed Hussain and the Zionists behind him, and also the like of Masters who run the mosques in the UK and back the Zionists less openly. They are two fingers on the same hand. You seek to separate evil men and even seek to portray one less so then the other. If this is the case bring forth your proof. I say seek guidance from Allah - be just even against your own brothers and speak the truth even against your kin. This is what Allah would want us to do. Do not be like the tribal chiefs of old - who said 'this is what our forefathers used to do'. Corruption has set into the Ummah, our leaders are the keepers of corruption cleanse it and be like the men who stood up against tyrants not like those who seek to cover the deeds of tyrants with excuses.
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2008-04-24 16:46:57
Madam:
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Reality -- No!
All further Mosques in the UK should be women-only or run by women. If existing mosques cannot handle the number of men wanting to pray, then the men must pray at home. It's time for them to be subservient to women. Once equality has been achieved THEN men can be allowed more mosques. The braying fools would deny Khadija and Ayesha a place in their beloved 'mosque', which is just a 'circus of beards'! Shame on you. Everything you say points to you being a totalitarian egotist (nothing 'Islamic' in your words). Men have made an utter mess of the Muslim world, and have corrupted the Deen to suit themselves. The tragedy of the Ummah is that Muslim women have allowed their men to act as total idiots. Change 'through education and patience'? I DON'T think so! 14 centuries is ENOUGH patience. No women: No mosque. Women must rule.
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2008-04-24 17:33:22
Reality:
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@Muhammad foster
I think u have failed to understand what I actually wrote? I wasn’t arguing that the secularist threat was greater than the Zionist threat or vice versa – rather pointing out that we face multiple threats and not all of them come under Zionism – thus we should not be short-sighted. With regards to the Masjid individuals such as Ibrahim Master I have stated; Part 2 — RealityAnd let me stress again –those 3 or 4 examples from the article of masjid individuals who allied with Zionism IS blameworthy and IS hypocrisy! Not following the hypocrisy of MPACUK (Trojan Horse) on this - does it mean one loves the Masjid leaders especially the hypocrites such as Ibrahim Master– Absolutely Not! Without a doubt any individual from Masjid committees or a Masjids which openly backs Zionist activates are a bunch of hypocrites that need to be opposed – but do we brush all 2000 Masjids and their leaders of the UK with the same brush – are all of them murderers as u allege who are directly responsible for the KILLING of Muslims?! Are all them hypocrites and apostates who have allied with the kuffar? Are we going to do takfir of the entire Majid committees, the imams and their leaders?! Let us indeed not go down the road of generalising! And the 3 or 4 examples of Masjid individuals who have allied with Zionists in the article – what does that have got to do with the specific issue of the establishment of this specific Masjid? 'this can only be changed through education and patience' — Muhammad FosterThis was specifically in regards to getting the doors of these Masjids open & encouraging them to facilitate for the sisters! U cannot change this situation over night! Let us not conflate the issue – blurring the topic at hand, insinuate, nor build up unfounded notions – that I am somehow defending the likes of Ibrahim master or ignoring the threat of Zionism!!!
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2008-04-24 20:31:08
IndigoJo:
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As-Salaamu 'alaikum,
Ed Husain is a no-mark sell-out who came out of nowhere last year and has made a living bad-mouthing (and bad-penning) the Muslim community and making negative generalisations (like telling the non-Muslims that we call them goreh, when this is just Urdu - which we don't all speak - for white people). He has also made some decidedly unorthodox pronouncements about the Shari'ah in public, as I detailed on my blog (see a post called "Today Programme Embarrassment"). In the past I have been called a "pacified muppet" by some of you for criticising MPACUK's tactics. What would you call someone who writes and talks like Eddie? Let's not forget, when people criticised "Shaikh" Hisham Kabbani on DeenPort in autumn of 2006, Ed (then using his full name of Mohammed Mahbub Husain) asked if we must wash dirty laundry in public. Then he goes and writes a book attacking the Muslim community, and pretends to be an authority (and is bigged-up by the most hostile elements in the mainstream, i.e. non-Muslim, media) based on having been a HT activist for five minutes in 1996 and out of the loop ever since. He is a hypocrite, and I mean in the commonly used sense, not (necessarily) the religious sense. As for the Tablighi markaz: the TJ or its proxy owned the land this mosque is to be built on well before the Olympics became an issue. Please remember that the Muslims who oppose building it are mostly Barelwi sectarians who just hate Deobandis and TJ for the same reasons they always have. They are a part of Muslim life in London, even though we may not agree with every position they hold, they do some valuable work in imparting religious knowledge and encouraging people to practise, and have a right to build their markaz. It is the Olympics, not the TJ's markaz, which is going to change the fabric of east London and price ordinary people (that includes some of you!) out of the market in their own home towns. If the issue of it being a TJ-controlled institution is a problem then a Muslim organisation should buy the TJ group out, so they can build their markaz elsewhere and a more universal Muslim mosque can be built in the present site.
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2008-04-24 22:04:10
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I have received countless calls over the last few days from people asking why MPACUK oppose the mega-mosque and why we were aligning ourselves with people like the Sufi Muslim Council and Ed Hussain. So I’ve written this article that might clarify and explain MPACUK’s position on this issue.
